LAURA STASSI

This is Dating While Gray. The grown-ups guide to love, sex and relationships. I'm Laura
Stassi.

DENNIS
Certainly there are times when you're a lonely. Times when you're everything.

MICHELLE
It was Laura like I saw the garage doors going down over their eyes.

LAURA STASSI
On this episode, I'm talking to people who are on their own, whether it's by choice or
circumstance. We are flying solo.

Now, I have nothing against people who are alone. It's just that I never expected to be that
way myself. I've spent most of my life living with other people. Four sisters and a brother
when I was little. Three roommates in college and then a husband and two kids who have
grown up. After my divorce, being alone seemed unnatural. I've gotten comfortable with it.
And that's a good thing, because in the four years since my divorce, I haven't had a
boyfriend, not one. I wasn't expecting finding love to be quick or easy, but I did think that
after all this time I would have made at least one love connection who would make it
worthwhile to give up the single life, even if only for a few weeks.

Now it's not like I'm the one who's always the decider. I remember this one man I met
online. His pictures were okay. His username wasn't obnoxious or dirty. His profile didn't
contain typos. We e-mailed back and forth a few times and then on a Saturday morning he
asked if I'd like to meet him for dinner the following Thursday. Sure, why not? "Okay,
great," he said, "let's get together today for our pre-date meeting." Now the experts advise
a quick meet and greet because there's too much pressure to have something like dinner
be your first date. But I figured we had communicated enough. I really did not want to have
a pre-date when I'd already agreed to have a date-date. And I had a lot going on, including
getting ready for a 10-mile race very early the next day. But he insisted and I wanted to be
agreeable. So I said, "Okay, I've got an hour this afternoon. Let's meet for tea." So we did.
And I have to say, I was pleasantly surprised. He was better looking in person than his
photos. We had a good conversation and the big spender even sprang for my tea. And
then afterward he emailed to say he enjoyed meeting me and good luck with the race. So
now I'm really looking forward to our actual date. But after the race, when I emailed him to
ask where he wanted to meet for dinner, he said, "Sorry, you're not my type." Alright,
buddy. Your loss. It's experiences like this that make me think, why bother? I'm fine on my
own and also if I'm being honest, ouch. It's hard to keep putting yourself out there.

I think I assumed I would stand out from a crowd. But boy, what a crowd it is. There are
about five million more single women, 50 to 74 years old than there are men that age. So
as a woman seeking a man, I'm up against a lot. But I also feel sorry for single, older
straight men because it sets up this weird stereotype. I've actually heard people say if a
man can't find a partner among the five million extra single older women, what's wrong
with him? He's got so many women to choose from. Is it so unbelievable that an older
straight man might be single because that's how he wants to be?

Meet my friend Dennis. He's in his late 60's and lives in New York City. I met Dennis over
a decade ago, back when I was still married. He was great company on this trip we were
on because he's the type of person who will say whatever's on his mind. And with Dennis,
there's always a lot on his mind. Dennis hasn't always been single. And I have wondered
lately if he's content. So I called him to ask about it. And I apologize for the poor audio
quality.

DENNIS
The last serious relationship I had, it lasted about, I don't know, 10 months. And I really do
not date at all. I don't go online. I have over the last 10, 12 years been set up with probably
six or seven blind dates by friends. All the women have been very nice and have had
compatible interests. But there was no real chemistry. I don't know if that chemistry is
gone, but I saw no reason to, you know, follow up with the second date. I have a feeling
that that part of my life is, you know, unless something comes along, I'm not looking for.

LAURA STASSI
When you say that, you don't know if you think the chemistry might be gone. Are you
saying you don't know if you are able to be attracted to anybody at this age?

DENNIS
No, not at all. It just is not important. I mean, I would love a companion, certainly am lonely
at times to go to a show with somebody to go to dinner, to travel with. But I'm not into the
effort. I don't go to bars. I'm not gonna go online. And the activities that I do probably do
not lend itself to to meeting people. I play bocce, I play ping pong, I swim, I do yoga, and I
actually do yoga at home. So I'm not even in a studio because yoga is primarily women
anyway. I do go on a yoga workshop, I hate the word retreat, for eight days in Costa Rica,
it's mostly women. But again, they're not there for dating, nor am I.

LAURA STASSI
I talk to a lot of single women who say all the good ones are taken. So how would you
respond to something like that?

DENNIS
Well, I agree with them. I don't think there's many good men.

LAURA STASSI
Oh my god, Dennis no!

DENNIS
I don't think that they're all gone. But I think it's harder to find a good man than a good
woman.

LAURA STASSI
So what do you think that you might do if you wanted to get serious about finding
someone?

DENNIS
If I wanted to, the easiest thing would would to go online.

LAURA STASSI
But you said you won't do that.

DENNIS
Well, I haven't done it, and I have not. It's not something I'm contemplating. You know, I
don't know in two or three years that that might change. But you also become comfortable
in your life. Even when I was dating Kelly back in '16 and '17, it affected my life. I didn't
play as much racquetball. You know, you have to make compromise. And I was willing to
do it because I thought it, she was great. And I also didn't have the freedom. I travel and
go and do whatever I want, whenever I want. And when you are, get in a relationship,
you're, it's not quite as one-sided. That freedom is good. It, you know, on a weekday night
or Saturday night at 7 o'clock after you've had dinner. You know, I'm left sitting reading
The New York Times or something like that.

LAURA STASSI
Yeah. Sometimes you get lonely?

DENNIS
Yeah. Yeah. Certainly the majority of the time I'm fine alone. But there certainly are times
when would be nice to, you know, cook someone dinner. And certainly there are times
when you're lonely, times when you're everything.

LAURA STASSI
What do you mean, times when you're everything?

DENNIS
I mean, there are times when you're happy or sad. You're mad, you're angry. You're you
know, whatever. Your life is filled with emotions. It's not one dimensional in any direction.

LAURA STASSI
Do you think you can experience all that more profoundly on your own? Cause everybody
knows you can be lonely in a relationship, too.

DENNIS
Well, to me, if you're lonely in a relationship, you don't have a relationship.

LAURA STASSI
Yeah okay.

DENNIS
A lot of people settle. Compromise. And to me and this is probably why I'm y'know, single.
You know, I always advise people not to settle and not to compromise. And so, you know,
if you're lonely in a relationship, you don't have a good route. You know, you want to be
with someone very, very special. I had an affair with a woman who I had dated in 1994 for
about five months, made a wrong decision, ended up marrying my second wife instead of
Randy a couple of years before I had gotten divorced. She got married for a second time
and we had an affair for probably about nine or 10 years.

LAURA STASSI
Oh.

DENNIS
And I, I think she's perfect. And I sometimes think that before I die that we'll be together. I
always think it might be when I'm 90, and that means I've still got a long ways to go.

LAURA STASSI
Does, you think she's perfect? That makes me a little sad.

DENNIS
I shouldn't say perfect. There is no such thing as perfect. But she and I get along incredibly
well. It's just completely easy. You know, we have a million things in common. So it's, you
know, to me it's the best relationship that I've ever been in. And from time to time we
speak and we text. If I ever see her name on the phone, it's just my life just lights up. I just
get excited.

LAURA STASSI
Awww.

DENNIS
You know, I'm not single and not dating because I'm waiting for her, but I don't necessarily
think it's gonna to happen. But, you know, who knows?

LAURA STASSI
I don't know, Dennis. You say you're not waiting around for this practically perfect woman
to become available, but maybe you are. Maybe you've decided no one else is worth
having to make the compromises people naturally make when they're part of a couple.
Being on your own means no compromising. And there are a lot of good things to be said
about not having to compromise, to not have to deal with any whims or issues or baggage,
but your own. So why does being part of a couple still feel like the ideal for me? Maybe I'll
figure it out after the break.

Love, sex and relationships aren't always easy to navigate, but one thing that's simple is
showing your support for this podcast. New shows like this one from WAMU are only
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the show notes. And thank you.

For me, being alone feels like a circumstance. It just happened to me. I wondered if
anybody else feels this way. So I talked with my friend Michelle. We first met in college,
then got back in touch a few years ago. I've always been impressed with Michelle's
ambition and drive, how she builds and maintains a large network of business colleagues
and friends, and how eager she is to find links among people she knows and connect them
to each other. And so it surprised me to learn that since her divorce several years ago, she
hasn't been able to make a romantic connection for herself. Over dinner in D.C., Michelle
told me that when she became single again, she set out to answer three questions.

MICHELLE
Do I still have it? Can I do this? And is it hard? And so I got on Match.com and, you know,
did a profile and a good picture. And I think I had 16 dates in three weeks.

LAURA STASSI
Wow.

MICHELLE
And the answers to my question were, do I still got it? Yes, I did. Can I do this? Yes, I can.
Is it hard? Not really. But it's demoralizing is what I found about online dating.

LAURA STASSI
Why do you say that?

MICHELLE
I am not a shrinking, retiring person and I found it. All the men that I were, was going out
with at a certain point. You know, you you're meeting somebody and you talk about your
life and you talk about what you're doing and you know where, what your history has been.
And when I said things like, "yeah, I worked at the White House, I was the only woman
who had that role when I was there. And I wasn't an assistant and I wasn't. I was like in a
substantive role that no woman had ever had before in history." It was Laura, like I saw the
garage doors going down over their eyes that they were like, "oh, she's not gonna be my
social secretary. She's not gonna be my deputy." Not that I'm high maintenance cause I'm
not high maintenance. But I think a lot of the men that I met, I got the feeling that they
weren't looking for a partner. They were looking for adjunct faculty. Do you know? They
were looking for, they were looking for somebody who was gonna, you know, like they
were gonna be the stars and you're gonna be the supporting character and that's not me.
So then I just stopped because it was I had answered my questions and it was not it was
not an inspiring experience for me.

LAURA STASSI
When was the last time you went out on a date?

MICHELLE
I can't recall.

LAURA STASSI
Well, that makes me sad.

MICHELLE
I know, cause I'm fabulous. Yeah, no.

LAURA STASSI
Years?

MICHELLE
Years. Yeah, years. I am the kind of person that I could go on a date and actually not
realize it's a date cause I have a lot of guy friends and a guy friend could say, "hey, you
want to go to the baseball game?" I would say, "sure." And I might not know it was a date.

LAURA STASSI
If you had had an invitation like that and you thought of it as a date. How would that
change your behavior?

MICHELLE
Might comb my hair. I think it would probably be that I would. I think I would probably a
little more nervous than I would be if it's just a friend.

LAURA STASSI
I want to explore this friend thing a little bit further because I think the best relationships
are, do start out as friendships. Do you have any male friends that you think have potential
to be a partner?

MICHELLE
A lot of my guy friends are married.

LAURA STASSI
Oh.

LAURA STASSI
And I'm friends with their wives.

LAURA STASSI
Yeah good for you.

MICHELLE
And so if they're, cause I'm a friend of marriage in general.

LAURA STASSI
Amen.

MICHELLE
I believe, and maybe it's a limiting belief and maybe it's my problem. But that men sort of
52 to 65 single men? I haven't met a lot of 'em. And then I also think that if they do find
themselves single, they're not looking to date a peer. And when I ask my friends, "do you
know anybody? You know if I got tickets to the Kennedy Center? And do you have a guy
that I can go with?" "No." They have 40 women friends who are single in that same age
group, but no guy friends. Do you see this, too, or is it just me?

LAURA STASSI
I, thank God for this podcast because I no longer have to worry about dating for me. I'm
gathering information. That's, that's my story and I'm sticking to it. I think there are plenty
of single men. But as one matchmaker told me and in a professional interview, she said
single men, for whatever reason, tend to go a lot faster than single women.

MICHELLE
Right. My girlfriends and I can go out to the theater or to a baseball game or to some sort
of art event. And they'll be five or six of us, attractive, intelligent, sophisticated, you know,
got it going on kind of people. And to a person, we will say, “where are our guy
counterparts? Where are they?”

LAURA STASSI
Where are they going?

MICHELLE
That's what that's exactly the question.

LAURA STASSI
So are you on any sites now?

MICHELLE
No, I'm not actively pursuing.

LAURA STASSI
I mean, I think we're all perfectly OK being by ourselves. But are we really perfectly OK
from an emotional standpoint, do you know what I mean?

MICHELLE
I have a friend who put something on Facebook, but she's sort of coming to the idea that
she may be permanently single. And when I read that phrase, it was like, oh, maybe that's
me. I'd never really heard that phrase or thought of that phrase. And then I really had to sit
down and ask myself am I, am I actually permanently single? Am I as a person who can't
remember the last date she went on? Is, is is it really that I have decided that I'm
permanently single? And so I sat with that for a while. And I don't want to think that I'm
permanently single. I want to think that because I'm out and about and I'm a nice person
and I'm engaging and I'm, I can pick up the check. You know, that all those things.

LAURA STASSI
Right.
MICHELLE
That I'm not gonna be permanently single. But the data points to a different fact.

LAURA STASSI
Yeah.

MICHELLE
I have a friend, Mark. I had lost touch with Mark and then we got in touch about five years
ago. And he was telling me about Jim. He said, “Michelle, we love each other so much.
We don't want either one to be alone at any time for the rest of our lives."

LAURA STASSI
Awwww.

MICHELLE
And there was something about that that made me think like, wow, maybe that's another
thing about relationships at this age that the relationship is more about let's walk together.

LAURA STASSI
Yeah.

MICHELLE
Let's walk together from here on out. Wouldn't it be kind of cool if at this age people just
we just like paired people up and just said, you know, just kind of be together the rest your
lives?

LAURA STASSI
Yeah. You think you may be permanently single and you're not.

MICHELLE
Unless somebody listening right now.

LAURA STASSI
I'll do a little matchmaking on the side.

MICHELLE
Yeah yeah yeah.

LAURA STASSI
Wouldn't it be kind of fun?

MICHELLE
Oh, I don't know, man. But, you know, I think that sometimes I'll be like I have a very
action-packed day with my work. And then I have you know, I'm pretty out there, you know,
doing things in the evenings.

LAURA STASSI
Yeah.

MICHELLE
And so sometimes I'll be at home, though, and I'm watching Netflix or whatever. And I do
think I wonder how many people around me would love to be sitting on my couch with me
watching Netflix.

LAURA STASSI
Right.

MICHELLE
Or would love for me to be sitting with them on their couch watching Netflix.

LAURA STASSI
Right.

MICHELLE
And I think, you know, if you were to like slice the top off buildings or homes, you'd see a
lot of people sitting by themselves. I am basically a hopeful human being. And I. I'm in
touch with my own resilience. And I, I know good things generally happen. So although I
kind of am wrestling with this idea, maybe I'm permanently single, but it doesn't mean I'm
resigned. You know.

LAURA STASSI
Yes.

MICHELLE
And it doesn't mean I've given up. It just means I'm trying to be realistic about where the
place where I find myself.

LAURA STASSI
Michelle doesn't want to think of herself as permanently single, even though at this point
she's been single almost as long as she was married. I don't think of myself as
permanently single either. And this may sound weird, but I'm uncomfortable with even
labeling myself as a single person. I think the other reason Michelle struggles with this idea
of being permanently single is because it doesn't feel like it was her decision. Somewhere
along the line, maybe that choice was made for her and now she's talking about being
hopeful, about finding love again. But just like me, she's not doing anything about it. So
how do you motivate yourself? Next up, I get a little coaching.

AMY
What are your top three priorities in the next three to six months? Do you have any goals
that you've set for yourself?

LAURA STASSI
Uhhhh. We'll be right back.

I enjoy talking to experts for Dating While Gray. But my favorite part of making this show is
hearing from ordinary people about their experiences with love, sex and relationships. I
want to hear from you. What have you learned? What do you want to know?

MARK
I don't like doing things alone. I don't like traveling alone. I've done it. I don't care for it. I
don't like dining out alone.

MARILYN
I would love to share my life with the right person. Not with the wrong person. You know?

EILEEN
It's not like men don't talk to me cause they talk to me all the time. But then again, I talk to
people all the time. So.
STEVEN
Y’know, it's pretty much like you. I'm hoping someone's gonna fall out of sky and land on
me.

MARILYN
I used to joke with a friend of mine who was a real introvert. You probably have better luck
if you didn't need to establish right away you need to be alone. Like she was trying to meet
people and wanted to make sure this was somebody who could leave her alone.

EILEEN
I will say I miss sex. I like sex in a relationship.

MARK
If it happens, it happens. If it doesn't, then perhaps God's just got a different plan for me.

EILEEN
I mean, we are still young, so it's not like it's not in the realm of possibility. Maybe I'm just
in hibernation. I don't know.

LAURA STASSI
Call me at 202-895-gray. That's 4729 and leave a voicemail. I listen to every message and
I can't wait to hear from you. 202-895-gray.

When I was talking with my friend Michelle, I basically told her, thank God for this podcast
because I don't have to worry about dating. I'm gathering information. I'm in the R&D
phase. But clearly I'm avoiding it. I'm avoiding the single label. I'm postponing putting
myself out there. And at some point I gotta decide if this is important enough for me to do
something. If I want to couple up, I have to be intentional. That's why I talked to Amy
Schoen. She's a certified life and relationship coach. And according to Amy, single people
who want to couple up need to be intentional.

AMY SCHOEN
You need to get a real clear vision of what you want in your life because different people
want different things and you need to find a partner who's going in the same direction. I
mean, you have your different kinds of people who want different things. The second thing
is the values need to be aligned, what you want and what you think is important. So what I
find out is that most people, they don't have a really concrete sense of their values and a
way to communicate it. And they're actually going after the wrong things.

LAURA STASSI
So values, meaning?

AMY SCHOEN
Things that are really close to you and really important to you. For instance, some people
it's a real deep faith in God. You know, they have a real sense of, of that and a spiritual
sense and they want a partner who shares that with them.

LAURA STASSI
Yeah. So let's say I come to you for help. Been divorced now I'm, you know, happy on my
own. Well, I'm independent. However, I would like a special someone in my life. So you
would have me envision what I want?

AMY SCHOEN
For your life.
LAURA STASSI
For my life.

AMY SCHOEN
First, cause I'm a life coach. I'm a certified professional life coach, so I wanna know what
you want for your life. What is that life vision to be able to communicate that to a partner
and also be able to express it. Whether it's online or, or verbally.

LAURA STASSI
OK, so I would then. So I would figure that out. And do I write it down or.

AMY SCHOEN
There are exercises I take my client through, yeah.

LAURA STASSI
And then once I do that?

AMY SCHOEN
Right. So there's the, the piece of getting to know you. So. So my process is first really
getting clear about who you are and what you want in a relationship and who's a good
partner for you. The second step is where do you, how do you put yourself out there? So
we have the whatnots at this age. I'm not thin, I'm not you know, I'm not.

LAURA STASSI
As successful as I want to be.

AMY SCHOEN
Right.

LAURA STASSI
I have problems with my kids.

AMY SCHOEN
Whatever, the I'm nots. You know, so. So the gre, so those are the gremlins. So to say,
well, who you are and what you do have to offer. You have a heart. You're a giving person.
And then we take that information and we sprinkle it into your profile and all that.

LAURA STASSI
What is the strategy for approaching people and for making sure? Like, for example, I
have been I've had conversations with a couple of usually men and they're like, oh, I know
somebody. He's single and he's your age. And that's the only discerning thing, OK, if
you're older and you're available. Let's get you two together. So what would be a?

AMY SCHOEN
So, so after. Part of my process is we drill down, we do something called the 30 second
informercial, which is like the elevator speech. So it's really drilling down to the five to
seven things that are really important for you so you can communicate that. And even to
the point where you put it in your notes of your of your phone now. I mean would be a
great thing to do. You have to go after somebody who I call is a connector. Not everyone's
gonna share. Not everyone's gonna be open. There are people who have networks of
people. They love connecting people.

LAURA STASSI
So instead of just mentioning loudly at family gatherings?

AMY SCHOEN
Right.

LAURA STASSI
"Hey, does anybody know anybody?"

AMY SCHOEN
Right.

LAURA STASSI
I would.

AMY SCHOEN
You gotta choose carefully.

LAURA STASSI
I would decide who among my social group or family is likely to have access to and want
to be able to connect me with someone with whom.

AMY SCHOEN
Right, they know and love you. Yes.

LAURA STASSI
Right. OK.

AMY SCHOEN
So then instead of just the who do you know? Then you give them something to kind of
remember about you. And when they do meet that person, they may say, oh, you know,
this is someone I need to introduce Laura to.

LAURA STASSI
It's it's hard, isn't it?

AMY SCHOEN
Well, that's a perspective. So what would be a different perspective that you would want to
take on?

LAURA STASSI
Well, I would want to take on the perspective that it's easy, but experience tells me it's
hard.

AMY SCHOEN
Well, how can you enjoy the journey?

LAURA STASSI
So that's what I would need to think about instead of saying, "oh, my God, this is so hard,
but I gotta do it." You know, it's like paying taxes. It's a pain to gather all those receipts and
then either do it yourself or send it off. But you have to do it. A lot of people think of dating
like that. I think I now that we're talking. I think I think of dating like that. This is what I have
to do in order to.

AMY SCHOEN
What would make it fun for you? I was at a point where I was like, if, if you know, like, are
you the one? Are you the one? I mean, I was driving myself crazy. And then I got an a ha.
You know? I was like, I'm just going enjoy my life. Now, I'm not I'm not gonna stop trying,
but I'm gonna enjoy my life. And I'm going to, you know, meet people and do things that I
wanna do. I mean, it was such a growth period for me. I did things and I met people I
would've never met. I went places I would never go, you know, embracing where you are.
Because you're at a great place in your life, a great time in your life, you have hopefully
many years ahead. You know, if there's longevity in your family and you're healthy and
and, and you know, everything goes right. Just think about what do you want to do in those
years.

LAURA STASSI
So I've heard a lot of people say, especially like when they're online, "I was just about to
quit. You know, I had given up and then boom, it happened." Or, "I stopped thinking about
it and then boom, it happened."

AMY SCHOEN
Yeah, well, I think being intentional and my clients are intentional and they don't give up.
But, but they also learn to relax a little about the process. And when you relax, I think you
draw in people and you don't repel people. So it's really about how do you put your best
self out there?

LAURA STASSI
Repel people. That's interesting. What would I do that would actually repel someone?

AMY SCHOEN
Well, my belief is if you're serious and you're looking for a serious relationship and the guy
isn't and he runs away, let him. The right people will be attracted to you. The wrong people
aren't. I like to see how dating is fitting into your whole life.

LAURA STASSI
OK.

AMY SCHOEN
Basically. So. So one of the questions I could ask you is what are your top three priorities
in the next three to six months? For you, you have any goals that you've set for yourself?

LAURA STASSI
Uhhhhh. My personal. Well, are they OK? This is terrible because I always I'm like parsing
every word. The realist in me says it would be really hard to find somebody, a committed
partner in three to six months. I would like to get on the path to finding a committed
relationship.

AMY SCHOEN
My clients come to me when they're really ready to make space in their lives for this. And
this is becoming top of mind.

LAURA STASSI
Right. Well, and.

AMY SCHOEN
And so my my question to you, I mean, if a guy met you right now, how ready would you
be for that relationship?
LAURA STASSI
Oh, totally ready. Totally ready. I am.

AMY SCHOEN
And how much time could you give a relationship?

LAURA STASSI
I, it means. So I'm pretty busy with life things. But my philosophy, my attitude has always
been you make time for the people who are important to you. And so I would make the
time. I would.

AMY SCHOEN
And how would you communicate to that person? Because what they're seeing is they're
seeing you as a very busy person. Actually, my story is my husband met me. We had one
date and he never asked me out for another date.

LAURA STASSI
What?

AMY SCHOEN
Yes. Five years later, we meet up again.

LAURA STASSI
Oh.

AMY SCHOEN
So he perceived me as being too busy for a relationship. So you may be hitting into that as
well.

LAURA STASSI
So it sounds like the fact that I'm having so much trouble answering these questions, I
think says something deep. And at the same time, shallow about me.

AMY SCHOEN [
No, I think what it is, is really getting clear about what you want for your life and what does
that look like and how, how you can make space for somebody in your life. I had a feng
shui consultant came to me once and said, "you don't have space for a man in your life.
You need to clean out a closet," that kind of thing. Do you have space for a man in your life
right now, is the question I'd like to leave you with.

LAURA STASSI
I like that, though. Do you have space in your life for a committed relationship? Space in
your life? It's not just emotional space. It, it also can be physical space.

AMY SCHOEN
Right.

LAURA STASSI
If you're taking care of an invalid parent and your grown kids have bounced back and are
living with you and you have a dog and the person's allergic to a dog, perhaps you don't
have the physical space in your life, which also might lead you to not have the emotional
space.

AMY SCHOEN
Well and not everyone's living together. So it really everybody gets to design what they
want at this stage. And there's no right or wrong, it's what's right for you.

LAURA STASSI
OK. You heard Amy say she did not have room in her life and so she cleaned out a closet.
Cleaning out a closet's gonna take a lot of work. So I do have in my en suite bathroom,
there are one, two, three, four, five, six drawers plus a cabinet plus a medicine cabinet. So
I've got a lot of space in this bathroom. And I suppose I could clear out a drawer or two.
Let me see. This is embarrassing. There are like a ton of loose cotton balls in one drawer.
The second drawer is Q-tips and waxing stuff and razors. Oh, and more cotton balls. God,
it's really messy. I don't think this is gonna work, but I'm cleaning out a bathroom drawer
anyway, just in case.

Dating While Gray is produced by Poncie Rutsch, Patrick Fort, Ruth Tam, Julia Karron and
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