BACKFIRING

Every V65 I have ever ridden seemed to emit a low level popping/spitting/backfiring sound during
deceleration. I would tend to consider this normal. Perhaps if your exhaust system is loose or damaged,
the popping sound may become loud and annoying, but on bikes with good exhaust, while the noise is
there, it does not seem to be a problem.
One answer in a Q&A column to the owner of a "spittin' Magna" suggests checking the "air cut-off valve"
in the carburetors, or checking for an air leak in one or more of the rubber intake collars which hold the
carburetors to the cylinder heads. If you experience what seems to be abnormal backfiring, it certainly
doesn't hurt to check into it, but don't go crazy. It may indeed be the normal inherent "spittin'" sound that
almost every V65 seems to emit.

BACKREST / REAR RACK

The Magna could be ordered with a factory option passenger backrest, which included a leather pouch
behind the cushion, and a relatively small rear rack which attached behind. It bolted in place of the stock
"grab handle". K&G made combination rear rack / passenger backrests which bolted to the sides of the
bike via custom brackets... stock rear grab handle remained in place. The K&G rear racks were much
larger than the OEM type. K&G also made a convertible backrest for the Magna that could be slid back
and forth on rails and thus positioned for either the passenger or rider. I've seen these on both V65 and
V45 Magnas. They are rare, but have been known to pop up at salvage yards.
I've never seen a factory backrest on a Sabre, but the 1985 Sabre brochure does list an "adjustable
backrest", and "backrest extension" as optional Hondaline equipment. I've seen aftermarket types, but
rarely. With the relatively flat seat of the Sabre, most passengers desire some type of backrest to keep
them from being flung off the back.
More about backrests to come in the future!

BATTERY
I have found batteries to last an average of three to four years in my V65s. Rob T. claims that the original
battery in his `85 V65 Sabre lasted seven years. Of course, battery life is somewhat a function of how well
the battery is cared for, and will vary. As most cyclists will tell you, it's false economy to try to get every
last mile out of a battery. When in doubt, especially after three years or so, replace it, and save yourself
from getting stranded. (Refer to MCN, 2/97, page 20, for excellent information on how to prepare and care
for your battery for maximum life and performance.)
It's important to check the water in the battery relatively often, especially if you do a lot of highway riding. I
topped off the water in my relatively new battery before leaving on a cross-country trip. During the trip, I
had failed to check the water. Only three weeks later, after 8,600 miles of 75 mph average riding, I found
the battery nearly empty. Other V65 owners report a high rate of battery water usage too. I recently put
both a V65 Magna Yuasa battery (YB18-A) and a V65 Sabre Yuasa battery (YB18L-A) side by side. They
are both 12 volt, 18 amp/hour, and appear 100% physically identical. However, the polarity is reversed
with respect to each other... the positive terminal is on the opposite side for each. Due to the similarities in
physical appearance and part numbers, it would be very easy to accidentally install a Sabre battery into a
Magna, or vise-versa. Always check the polarity before installation. According to a J.C. Whitney cross-
reference measurement chart, the Magna version battery is supposed to be approximately 1/16" larger in
length, width, and height, than the Sabre version. ?
Gaylon G. uses a Yuasa Yumicron "CX" lead calcium battery in his Magna, as opposed to the regular type
Yumicron. Since Yuasa does not currently make the CX type in the Magna/Sabre size, Gaylon found a
size designated for a Harley (YB16-B-CX) that will fit his Magna. It's about 3/8" wider than stock
(according to a J.C. Whitney cross-reference measurement chart), "but will fit with some coaxing, re-
arranging of cables, and modifying the battery box". According to Yuasa, the CX type batteries generate
up to 8% more cold cranking amps, hold their charge three times longer during storage, and use 80% less
water, than the regular Yumicron. Yuasa admits that at this time, they do not plan to produce a lead
calcium version of the YB18-A or YB18L-A. I'll add that the YB16-B-CX that Gaylon installed in his Magna
may fit a Sabre more easily, due to the nature of the Sabre battery case and cable configuration.
However, I have yet to confirm this. There might be side cover interference. Anyone?
Tom F. recommends using a "Battery Tender" charger during storage... works great and doesn't
overcharge. I have one too, and love it. After a year though, mine failed, but I sent it back to the
manufacturer, and they replaced it immediately with a new one, no questions asked... five year
warrantee.
Care must be taken when using a battery tender. Some are poorly regulated, and may cause more
problems than they cure.
By the way, if your battery vent tube is cracked or rotted, simply replace it with some 5/32" clear vinyl
tubing available from most auto or hardware stores. A 2' length should be more than enough. The vinyl
resists acid just fine.

BLOW-BY

If you have observed what appears to be excessive "blow-by" pressure from the oil dipstick hole, do not
fear. It seems that all V65s act this way. Apparently, the pressure felt is not blow-by, but mere oil
"windage", an oil mist being thrown up by the moving parts below. The V65 has an adequate crankcase
ventilation system which relieves any blow-by pressures.

BOLTS / STUDS

Many have accidentally broken studs and bolts that had become seized over time, especially exhaust
flange studs and engine cover bolts. To avoid problems in the future, use a high heat anti-seize lubricant,
such as Permatex #133, when installing all nuts and bolts.

BRAKE, REAR PEDAL HEIGHT

Regardless of what the manuals say, the V65 Sabre rear brake pedal height should be adjusted
approximately 1/4" below the top of the footpeg, and the V65 Magna pedal, approximately 3/4" above the
top of the footpeg. The Sabre's footpegs are about 8 inches behind those of the Magna, relative to the
seat position. This difference in peg position causes the leg/foot angles to be different for each model,
necessitating different brake pedal positions.

BRAKES
As many have pointed out, it's a good idea to lubricate the caliper pivot pins every 1-2 years, since they
tend to stick after a while if not properly lubricated. Corroded pins will cause uneven pad pressure and
thus uneven wear. Of course, when lubricating these pins, use a high heat resistant type lubricant, and
use it sparingly.
According to the MagSab page, Honda OEM pads and EBC greens are given favorable reports by
enthusiasts. EBC blacks are less well liked, and are felt to be inferior to OEM pads. One member claims a
major improvement with Ferodo pads.
Most who have swapped in a set of aftermarket stainless braided brake hoses have claimed a major
improvement in brake response. (see HYDRAULIC LINES). More about this in the 'Magna
Book' Section
Case Guard / Crash Bars
Most agree that the original OEM type accessory V65 case guards are the best. The problem is that they
are hard to find. Even in salvage yards, most used case guards to be found will have already been
damaged.
The OEM style case guard serves as an excellent spot to support the front end of the bike during
servicing. Simply place the bike on it's centerstand. Then, anyone with average strength will be able to lift
the front end of the bike off the ground by gripping the front rim with one hand. While doing so, slide a
jackstand under the case guard with the other hand. In less than a minute, both wheels are off the ground
with only the need for one small jackstand. Very convenient. However, be sure to position the bike and/or
chuck a wheel in such a way so that the bike cannot accidentally move forward and cause the
centerstand to collapse.

Case guards for the Magna are currently available through J.C. Whitney, but are a different style than the
OEM type.
They bolt up to the radiator mounts as well as the frame. They are a viable alternative, since there are
no other suppliers, however, the stock Hondaline are still the best.

Charging System
I noticed that according to the Honda shop manuals, the V65's alternator should deliver 25 amps
minimum, no load, at 5,000 rpm. However, the Magna manual describes the output as 300W @ 5,000
rpm, while the Sabre manual says 350W at 5,000 rpm. (amps X volts= watts) Also, the shop manual calls
for delivery of 10.2 amps minimum, no load, at 1,000 rpm. However, due to operating load, the owners
manual reminds us to avoid prolonged idling, since "the battery will not charge while the engine speed is
below 1,100 rpm."
Does anyone wish to calculate the total amount of amps normally being drawn from a running V65? If you
figure a stock 60W highbeam, taillight (8W), front marker lights (16W), additional rear marker lights (16W),
and instrument lights (about 15W ?), there's a total of 115 watts, or 10 amps being drawn from the lights
alone, not counting the intermittent lights (brake light and turn signals). Swap in a 130W highbeam, and
you're up to 185W, or 15 amps. Can anyone relate how many amps are drawn by the fuel pump, ignition
system, and fan? Other? Many enthusiasts are interested in knowing how much room is left for electrical
accessories with respect to the alternator capacity.

Clutch
Keith M. replaced his stock clutch at 40k. Bruce Bennett replaced his at 30k, and needs one again at 70k.
Robert T. still has his original clutch at 107k.
The V65 uses a "wet" clutch, and thus it is traditionally not recommended to use fully synthetic oil.
However, newer synthetics claim compatibility with wet clutches.
Bill A. has been experiencing a slipping clutch in his V65 Magna. Bill had been using Mobil 1, but has now
switched to Honda HP4 oil. The clutch is still slipping, even though a mechanic has diagnosed the clutch
itself as being in good order.
Kurt G. tried Castrol Syntec 5/50 in his V65 Sabre, and experienced immediate clutch slipping. He then
switched to Mobil 1, and has since had no problems.
Nearly 30% of all V65 contributors claim to use Mobil 1, Castrol Syntec, or other synthetic oils, and have
not reported clutch problems.
It's still a bit of a mystery, whether or not certain synthetic oils will cause wet clutches to slip. Dig up your
8/96 copy of MCN, and re-read the synthetic oil reader forum response article on page 32. Some report
immediate slipping, some report zero slipping. It seems to be a hit or miss situation. Many stick with
regular motorcycle oil to play it safe.
Some enthusiasts have replaced their stock clutch with a kevlar Barnett clutch, and report that they work
fine, feel just like stock. One Honda dealer once warned against using aftermarket clutches, stating that
there was some incompatibility... something to do with steel to aluminum contact and wear... ? No
troubles reported by those with aftermarket clutches however.
Thomas B. experienced an unpleasant clutch system failure on his V65 Sabre. He was stuck in heavy
traffic in high heat, and gradually lost the operation of his clutch. Many others have had the exact same
experience, including myself. The lever comes in, but the clutch will not disengage. If this should happen,
pull over, stop the engine, and let things cool for a while. Once cooled, the clutch will operate again. Fully
flush the clutch hydraulic system with brand new DOT 4 fluid from a sealed container a.s.a.p. (see
HYDRAULIC SYSTEM)

Clutch Cover (Right Side Engine Cover)

The MagSab pages remind us to be careful when removing the right side engine cover, also referred to as
the clutch cover. "The starter idler gear turns on a dowel pin between the clutch cover and crankcase. It
can fall off when the cover is removed; be prepared so it doesn't get damaged. To get it back on, put a
wrench on the crank and rotate it a little while working the gear back into place".
Note: some or all `86 V65 Magnas came with fully polished clutch covers, where as earlier models came
with black painted covers, polished aluminum only in the center.

Connectors, Electrical
It is important that all electrical connectors be clean and tight to avoid wire/ connector meltdown
problems, and other problems.
Permatex offers "dielectric tune-up grease", which is designed for use on electrical connections to seal
out moisture/corrosion, and makes for easy uncoupling in the future. Perfect for spark plug wire
connections too.
See the FAQ for further details.

Decal
On both Magnas and Sabres, there is a warning/information label affixed to the top of the gas tank near
the filler cap. Many have expressed interest in removing the unsightly decal, but do not want to risk
harming the original paint. Some feel that the decal would have been easy to remove when new, but after
years of baking in the sun, etc., may never come off. Others have said it'll come right off with no problem,
using an effective decal removing solution. Does anyone have any experience with this? I suspect that it
would be impossible to remove the decal without leaving behind at least some small detectable blemish, if
not making a big mess altogether. Plus, it may leave behind a fade ghost.

Differences B/W Magna & Sabre

Aside from the obvious differences, the following are a few of the mechanical/ engine differences between
the Magna and Sabre. Most of this info is detailed in the 5/84 CycleWord, and 7/84 Cycle articles.

The Sabre (VF1100S) has larger diameter carb venturis, a larger airbox, larger diameter exhaust header
pipes, larger volume mufflers, and "wilder" cam timing, than the Magna (VF1100C).
Also, the Sabre's rear wheel is 17", using a 130 size tire. The Magna: a 16" rear wheel and 140 size tire.
Note that because of the smaller Sabre tire, the Sabre's total rear wheel/tire diameter is only about 3/8" -
1/4" greater than the Magna's, even though the Sabre's rim is 1" greater. Being that the gearing is the
same for both bikes, and the total rear tire diameters are nearly the same too, the total effective gear
ratios are essentially the same. At the most, the Sabre's engine may spin a few hundred rpm less than the
Magna's when at identical highway speeds in top gear.

So apparently, the Sabre was intended to yield a bit more horsepower with its wilder cams, larger
exhaust, etc. However, after riding several V65 Sabres and Magnas, I did not notice any obvious
performance difference between the two. It's a mystery to me why Honda would try to up the top end on
the model intended for "sport touring". With its heavy fairing/hardbag option, larger diameter rear wheel,
and long distance appeal, it would seem to make more sense to try to dial in a bit more low end if
anything, not top end. On the other hand, the Magna was intended as a "muscle-bike" drag-race
boulevard cruiser. It's a model that appeals specifically to the power hungry, and thus could use all the top
end horsepower possible in order to win races. So why did Honda "hotrod" the Sabre as opposed to the
Magna? Well, it doesn't matter much anyway, since again, the real world performance is about the same
with both models. Even the magazine tests show that both the Magna and Sabre run about the same...
both yield low-mid 11s in the quarter. According to the Honda shop manuals, the Sabre produces 118 h.p.,
and the Magna, 116 h.p. According to tests done by Cycle Magazine, the Sabre produces 101 h.p., and
the Magna, 105 h.p. Essentially identical.

Sabres have "extra" brackets that solidly connect the front cylinder head to the front frame tubes, whereas
Magnas do not. Why the extra "engine mounts" on the Sabre? The 7/84 Cycle article suggests that this is
done for "extra chassis rigidity". I have noticed that my Sabre seems to vibrate a bit more than my Magna,
especially at higher rpms. Before I had noticed the extra mounts, I thought that my Sabre's engine had a
minor internal balance problem, but now I suspect that the extra vibration is simply due to the solid
mounts. I haven't had a chance to ride any other V65 Sabres recently. Any thoughts or comments?

Driveline Play
A 1984 Sabre test article points out a "disturbing amount of driveline lash". A very large number of
contributors have complained of excessive play/lash in the drivetrain as well. Yes, both my Magna and
Sabre are also loose, each to about the same degree.

While most peoples' initial reaction is to suspect the universal joint as being the source of the play, it
seems that this is not be the problem. I would tend to rule out the U-joint, since if such noticeable play
existed at the U-joint, it would lead to near term failure under the brut torque of the V65. I've never heard
of a V65 experiencing a failed U-joint.

V65s have a "damper cam" device in the driveshaft. This device is designed to absorb shocks. If the
damper cams and/or related spring is worn, excessive play will result. Several enthusiasts and mechanics
feel that the damper cam system may be inherently weak, causing the lash.

However, Kurt Grife disassembled his driveline, and noted that his damper system "felt" tight, but audible
play was detected in the transmission. Kurt points out that if the annoying play is coming from the tranny,
the damper system will soften the effects of the tranny play, and actually help the situation.

With my fully assembled Sabre up on its centerstand and "locked" in first gear, I rocked the rear wheel
back and forth within it's "loose play" range. As measured at the outer most tip of the tire, at the tread, the
rear wheel will travel a total of 2 3/4" back and forth. It's hard to locate the source of the play, but noise is
detected near or in the tranny, as Kurt noted. It's important to remember that this test does not take into
account the load that exists when riding.
This driveline play, as described above, nearly caused R.J. Mirabal Jr. to drop his `86 V65 Magna when
parking. R.J. suggests the following when parking nose-first down an incline and putting the tranny in gear
to keep the bike from rolling: after putting the bike in gear, be sure to allow the bike to roll forward within
its lash range, and positively "lock" against 1st gear BEFORE putting down the kickstand. Otherwise, the
bike might roll forward enough to cause the kickstand to fold up, thus toppling the bike.

Fan Stat Switch

Sal Diliberto experienced a failed fan thermostatic switch at 5k, and replaced it with an OEM unit at the
cost of $61.

According to the MagSab page, you can replace the stock thermostatic switch with an "ECHLIN #FS130"
switch which can be obtained from a Napa Autoparts store for $28. This switch turns on at 191-197F
(ascending) and off at 182-187F (descending). This is about 20 degrees cooler than the stock switch,
which is rated to turn on at 208-215F. "The element is about 1/2" longer than the stock Honda one, but it
screws in and has two bayonet connectors as found on early V4s". There are other switches that will work
too, further info available on the internet.

If I remember correctly, there is a newer fan stat switch offered by Honda that operates at a cooler
temperature than the original. Apparently, the current replacement fan switch designated for the
V65 IS this new lower temperature version. Check the internet, as I have misplaced the details.

Some enthusiasts specifically wish to have their engines run cooler to help extend engine/camshaft life.
To achieve this, they either use a manual fan switch, or use one of the newer lower temperature fan stat
switches.

The V65 shop manual lists the opening temperature of the thermostat as being between 176-183F
degrees. Of course, if one were to obtain a fan stat switch that turned the fan on at or below the
thermostat opening point, the fan would often run unnecessarily, stressing the fan and battery. The specs
of Napa ECHLIN switch described above would be the "coldest" I would personally recommend. (See
GAUGES)

John Knepp's fan failed to work, but only the connector needed replacement.

Gaylon G. experienced a failed fan motor at 40k.

Fender, Front
The Magna's front fender is quite small as James Parrot pointed out. Keith Mazelin has added a front
fender mudflap to his Magna. I have also added a small mudflap to my fender in order to keep the front
valve cover and engine from getting continually pelted with stones and mud. Because the clearance
between the tire and fender is small, I used thin sheet metal to make the flap. I attached it by drilling a tiny
hole in the fender and using a small nut and bolt. Installing such a mudflap will help extend the life of your
front valve cover and engine finish.

F.O.I.L.
Apparently, only V65 Magnas and V45 Sabres came with the "F.O.I.L." Fiber Optic Integrated Lock.
Open your F.O.I.L. system battery compartment, and remove the old 9-volt battery before it leaks acid.
However, replacing the battery cover without inserting a battery makes the cover difficult to remove in the
future, though possible. Without the battery in place, no spring pressure is available to pop the cover out
once releasing the latch.

Fork Brace
Ray T. and a few others have cracked their OEM fork braces. After breaking two, Ray finally chose to
machine an improved version out of billet 7075-T6 aluminum. Ray feels that perhaps the anti-dive until
which affects only one of the fork tubes may cause stress on the brace, causing breakage. Ray relates
that setting the anti-dive adjustment to "2" should make this tube act the same as the opposite non-anti-
dive tube.

Both Ken St.Amant (Sabre) and Gaylon G. (Magna) have added a "Superbrace" heavy-duty fork brace to
improve handling, but observed no noticeable improvement.

Tony Donisi had a terrible suspension failure at 85 mph resulting in a crash. (refer to attached story by
Tony) He apparently noticed that the stock fork brace had separated perhaps contributing to the disaster,
among other things. Afterwards, Tony used a new OEM stock brace, but added a support plate as well,
machined out of T6061 aircraft aluminum, 3/8" thickness.

Fork Seals
A large number of Magna and Sabre owners have had to replace their fork seals. A typical life is about
40k - 50k miles.

I had a bad leak on one of my old V45 fork seals. I removed the entire fork arm from the bike (fairly simple
bolt-out procedure), but could not find a tool to remove the heavy ring clip which is recessed into the fork
slider, and thus I could not remove the seal. Plus, I've heard that even with the right tool, the clip can be
very difficult to remove. I brought the fork tube only to my local dealer, who then sold me a seal kit for $20,
and charged me $24 to install. Some other dealers quoted me over $200 for an entire fork seal job on the
bike. Others have reported paying around $150 -$180 for a complete seal job.

The reason my seal failed, was because there was a small rust pit, a tiny spot where the chrome had
become raised, on the fork tube. This protrusion cut a notch in the seal, causing a big leak. The dealer
tried to sell me a whole new tube, but instead, I carefully ground the raised spot down with a file, then
polished it until extremely smooth. Though there resulted a tiny pit/hole on the tube, the new seal worked
fine, and lasted a long time until I sold the bike, zero leakage. Tip: keep the fork tubes clean and waxed.

David Hickey also had a similar fork seal failure experience, caused by pits on the tube. He nearly
purchased a new $225 tube, but instead had a mechanic emery cloth the old tube. A new seal was
installed on the old tube, and 15k later, the seal is still fine.

If you look at the area where the fork tube goes into the fork slider, there is a rubber "seal". This is
not the fork seal, but just an external "dust seal". Below that, on `83 and early `84 models (maybe `82
V45s also), there is a secondary "sponge/foam seal" and plastic washer. Then comes the actual fork oil
seal. My dealer told me that there was a service bulletin issued that says to remove and discard the
"sponge/foam seals" (and plastic washers too) if you have them, since they collect dirt and trap it near the
oil seals. Then, I noticed in the Clymer repair manual, it stated to indeed remove and discard these
"sponge/foam" seals, and for the reason: "the foam seal may work it's way down into the oil seal and give
the appearance of a worn or leaking oil seal". I'm not sure exactly what they mean by that, but I suppose if
you have an `83 or `84, and you note that you have these "foam/sponge" seals under the dust seals,
remove them. Though I'm not certain, it may be possible to remove the unwanted foam seals without
disassembling the fork. Perhaps pop the dust seal off and slide it up out of the way, then pick out the foam
seal, cut it, and remove it. Has anyone tried?

Another tip to prolong the life of your seals, is to keep fork air pressure low. You may enjoy the stiffer
handling produced by high air pressure, but it puts a strain on the seals. I once bought a used Magna,
seals appeared fine for the first several days of riding. After observing zero psi in the forks, I added about
6 psi to stiffen the front, and the seals started leaking immediately.

Chuck Jenke recommends using rubber foam boots by Naj that cover the fork tube, to keep dirt/bugs off,
etc.

I make it a point to clean the fork tubes often, especially during long high speed trips through buggy
areas. Splattered bug guts can become surprisingly hard and abrasive once dry.

If you are changing the fork oil seals yourself, the MagSab page offers the following tip: instead of buying
an expensive fork seal driver tool from Honda, you can make your own seal tool from a piece of PCV
pipe. For V45s (39mm fork tubes), use 1.5" pipe. For V65s (41mm fork tubes), get a 2" pipe with a 1.5"
coupler, then grind or rasp the coupler down so it will fit inside the fork body, and use a piece of 2" on top.

Fuel Filter
Many enthusiasts have switched to aftermarket fuel filters. I currently use a Purolator PRO #804, 1/4". It is
a multi-piece glass case filter with replaceable inner mesh element. It's a bit longer with less diameter
than the stock filter, but will fit fine. It's nice to have a glass "see-through" filter for easy trouble-shooting.
Also, you can keep an eye on the fuel quality, dirt, rust, etc. This Purolator filter is tagged at 10psi max. It
has never leaked a drop.

Fuel Pump
One V4 owner that had experienced a fuel pump failure told me that he was able to swap in a typical
automotive fuel pump which cost less than the Honda-cycle part. I'm guessing that any Japanese auto
(Toyota, Honda, etc.) pump with similar dimensions and specs will work. Any comments or part numbers?

Fuel Pump Relay

I experienced a failed fuel pump relay on my `83 V45 Magna at about 40k miles... about $40. A few others
have experienced the same.

Interestingly, the bike would continue to run without an operating fuel pump, running on gravity feed from
the full fuel tank. The bike would barely go over 20 mph however, before coughing and starving for fuel. If
your fuel pump should fail to operate in the middle of nowhere, and if the tank is fairly full, you may be
able to ride (slowly) back to civilization... worth a try.

Fuel Tank / Gauge

Many enthusiasts wish their Magnas had a larger fuel capacity. The Magna can hold 5.3 gallons total: 4.5
main tank + 0.8 reserve tank. Most travel about 150 miles before the reserve warning light comes on.
After that, if you're careful, you can squeeze 15 -20 more miles out of what's left. Don't count on this
however, since over the years, the reserve warning light senders used were a bit different. Some report
getting over 20 miles after the light comes on, some report only 10, etc. A friend replaced the sender in his
V45, and the replacement was noticeably shorter than the original. Some have said that if you have a
deep sender that does not give enough of a warning, the sender leg can be bent upward so as to cause
the light to come on earlier.

Sabre owners enjoy a greater total fuel capacity of 5.8 gallons, a half gallon more than the Magna. The
Sabre has just one main fuel tank, no reserve tanks, but has a full LED fuel gauge. The Sabre shop
manual lists a 5.8 gallon main tank, plus a 1 gallon reserve. Perhaps an error.

Tip: don't excessively overfill your tank in hopes of obtaining a greater range. If you top off the tank too
much, you will encounter a spill over, due to the expansion of the cold fuel once entering the hot tank. You
may fill it to what seems to be a safe half-inch or so below the cap, but soon after, even if the cap is
closed, fuel will begin flowing out from under the cap and all over the place. Leave at least an inch of
safety margin below cap... maybe more on very hot days.

When I had purchased my V65 Magna, it had a bad case of rust in the main fuel tank. Fortunately there
were no leaks yet. I purchased the most expensive heavy duty fuel tank sealer sold by Eastwood
Restoration (sealer #1161) back in 1992, followed all directions to a tee, and applied the sealer. I used
Rust-mort (available at auto paint suppliers) to etch the tank prior to sealing. Now, five years later, my
tank is perfect, zero problems. The rust is permanently sealed, and absolutely none of the sealer has
melted or peeled off, even using occasional fuel additive and stabilizer. Recommendation: if you need to
repair your tank, buy only a high quality sealer, and follow the directions VERY carefully, in order to avoid
a big mess.

The MagSab page notes that the standard liquid tank liner available and marketed toward bikes is called
Kreem, and the SabMags offer the following helpful tips for those who intend to treat their tanks with
Kreem:

"Don't buy the kit containing one bottle each of the three solutions, since you'll need more than one bottle
of etching solution. However, one bottle of the liner is plenty, good enough for 2 to 3 tanks. The kit
recommends to shake around some nuts and bolts inside the tank to loosen the rust. Since some find it
hard to remove the nuts and bolts after, another alternative is to use a chain instead, and hold the end for
easy removal. All the involved solutions are harmful to the paint, so be careful. To dry the solutions inside
the tank, you can use a shop vac set to exhaust mode to circulate air throughout. (I'll add that I had used
a hose adapted to my small household dehumidifier, to circulate low pressure dry air throughout the tank
for over 24 hours.) Before drying, make sure the fuel outlets/connections are open, and not clogged with
solution. (I'll also add that there were several articles in past MCN issues that described multiple failures
when using Kreem... the Kreem peeled off over time, clogging the tank, the only fix being to cut tank open
to remove debris. However, apparentIy, if the directions are followed perfectly, the Kreem system should
work o.k.)

Gauges
Concerning the stock bar-style temperature gauge, the MagSab pages offer the following temperature
equivalents:

1 bar, 115F;
2 bars, 129F;

3 bars, 162F;

4 bars, 199F;

5 bars, 216F;

6 bars, 239F;

7 bars, 266F

The first two bars are considered the "warm up" period. Bars 3 to 6 denote normal operating temperature.
The bikes usually operate in the 3 to 4 bar range, unless in traffic where the 5 to 6 bar range will most
likely be encountered. The fan should keep the engine from exceeding the 6 bar mark. The seventh bar
means danger, and under normal circumstances should never be encountered. If 7 bars should appear,
shut off the engine and look for a problem... (low coolant level, inoperative fan, bad thermostat, etc.)

Jeff Dean continues to get a high reading on his V65 Magna temperature gauge, even after replacing the
coolant, radiator cap, thermostat, and fan thermo switch. Jeff suspects that his gauge is at fault, yielding a
higher reading than correct, as referred to in a past Honda service report.

Robert T. had the bezel around the instrument cluster disintegrate twice on his `85 Sabre. Rob suggests
to tighten the screws just past finger tight when replacing the bezel so as not to stress it.

The 1985 Sabre brochure lists a voltmeter and altimeter as "optional Hondaline equipment". Has anyone
ever seen these? Describe.

Handlebars
Despite what some manuals say, 1983 V65 Magnas came with a "three-piece" adjustable handlebar.
Most `84s, and all `85's-`86's came with a typical one-piece handlebar. Apparently, both `84 and `85 V65
Sabres came with a three-piece adjustable bar. I believe that the three piece bar used on the Magna and
Sabre are the same, except that the Magna version is chrome, the Sabre version, black. One test article
states that the Sabre bars are a few inches shorter than the Magna's. Anyone?

The three-piece bar is nice, and allows you to adjust the degree of bar pullback, in addition to the regular
adjustment at the triple-clamp. The Magna three-piece version has nearly the same height or "rise" as the
later Magna one-piece version.

Most feel that both the one and three piece type bars used on these bikes are too tall. Stock bars, even if
adjusted forward, allow too much of a leaned back posture. Such a seating position will have your lower
back burning with pain in a relatively short amount of time... sore arms too. Many Magna owners,
including myself, have switched to lower bars. Big improvement! A lower bar allows a more leaned
forward posture, which seems to shift the stress from the lower back to the upper back and shoulders.
Typically, the upper back is stronger and is better suited for endurance than the lower back. Adding a
lower handlebar to my Magna made enough of an improvement to allow a pleasant and comfortable
8,600 mile trip across the country in under three weeks.
Commonly, handlebar manufacturers measure their bars in three ways: overall length, rise, and pullback.
My general recommendation is to obtain a bar with about 2"-3" less rise than stock, and about 2" less
pullback than stock.

I would recommend the exact model bar I currently use (old Yamaha touring), but unfortunately, it has
been discontinued. However, there are others out there that are very similar in size, and will work fine. My
"Yamaha" bar came as a 33" length, but I chopped an inch off either end to make it a bit more to my
liking.

The following are a few handlebar recommendations specifically for Magnas. Such sized bars will
probably work fine on Sabres too. However, Sabres with the original sport fairing may have trouble
accepting certain bars, possibly experiencing bar to fairing interference.

A bar rise less than 4" along with a pullback greater than 6" may result in bar to tank interference. It
depends on the exact shape of the bar, and how one likes them adjusted. A bit of trial and error may be
involved.

Note: bars used on Magnas/Sabres must have a good 9" or so of straight length from the end of the bar
(on each side) to the beginning of the first curve. Otherwise, the controls/grips won't slide on all the way,
and the grips will be hanging past the ends of the bar.

Rise Pullback Length

Stock 1985 V65 Magna bars 8.0" 7.5" 30"

aftermarket Yamaha touring used on my `85 Magna

5.5" 6.5" 31
(discont.)

aftermarket bars used by Demetri Kokkoris, `84 Magna

5.5" 30"
(discont.) . . 5.5"

aftermarket bars recommended by Keith Mazelin.

5.5" 6.5" 29"
"KZ1000, or or K+N Superbike style"

K+N Superbike type used by Jim Lehman, `84 Magna 2.5" 4.8" 29"

K+N "Magna extra-wide" Superbike as in 1994 K+N

4.0" 6.5" 32"
catalog

Handling
It seems that V65s, as well as many other bikes, will produce a front end shake during deceleration. If you
are slowing down, hands very lightly on the handlebar, the fork will want to shake back and forth if you let
it. Some tires seem to promote this problem more than others. Regardless, all V45s/V65s I have ever
ridden produce the same results. As long as you hold the handlebar reasonably firm (as you should be
anyway), the fork should not shake, nor should it fight against you.

Gaylon G. reports head shake at 30 - 40 mph with hands off bars... same as above. Gaylon notes
however, that the shake effect he experienced became reduced after switching to Dunlop 491s from
Dunlop Qualifiers.

Ken St.A. reports great instability at over 120 mph with his `85 V65 Sabre... handlebars shake back and
forth, sometimes severely, especially on curves. More stable with a passenger however. Adding a
"Superbrace" fork brace did not help. I did notice that Ken has a windshield/fairing as listed on his
questionnaire.

James Parrot reports high speed instability with his `85 V65 Magna specifically with his windshield.

Malcolm Davies reports that his `85 Sabre wallows a bit over 100 mph, perhaps the result of soft
suspension settings.

Many complain of front end lightness... loss of steering control upon hard acceleration. (see FRONT END
LIGHTNESS).

Head / Valves - Performance Concerns

Ray T. reports that the stock V65 cylinder head castings are terrible, and the ports could use a good
deburring/cleaning for improved performance. In addition, Ray has treated his heads to a three angle
valve seat cut, noting that the factory seats were pitted and way out of spec.

Horns
Several Honda owners report horn failure. This is usually due to corrosion. Since new Honda horns are
expensive, most owners either grab used ones from a salvage yard, or buy aftermarket horns. When
buying from a salvage yard however, have the horns tested before you pay. The larger percentage of
used horns do not work.

I recently experienced a horn failure. I checked and cleaned all connections, still wouldn't beep. I then got
angry, removed the plastic trim, and whacked it hard a few times. It then began to beep again as usual.

The MagSab page relates that aftermarket air horns by Fiamm are loud, and highly regarded by several
V65 owners. They can be found at some auto supply stores. Malcolm Davies was able to order Fiamms
for his Sabre through the J.C. Whitney auto catalog for $20. Whitney lists the dual trumpet Fiamms under
the name "Signaltone", part #12NZ8359Y.

Rusty Marcotte has added a pair of car horns to his Sabre.

Hydraulic Lines / Bleeding

I have met owners who have never flushed their hydraulic lines since 1983, without problems. However,
to avoid experiencing hydraulic failures on the road, it is strongly recommended to flush all hydraulic lines
at least once every two years. The hydraulic fluid (DOT 4 brake fluid) absorbs moisture over time, and
eventually becomes susceptible to vapor lock under high heat conditions... the clutch system usually goes
first, and causes the clutch to become inoperable.

When flushing the lines, always use brand new fresh DOT 4 fluid from a sealed container. Two 12 oz.
bottles of fluid are enough to fully flush all three systems. Don't buy more than you need, because
whatever is left over should technically be discarded, unless you intend on using it in the near future. Be
careful not to spill any fluid, as it will harm painted/ finished surfaces.

Many report a noticeable improvement in brake response after replacing the original rubber hydraulic
lines with braided stainless steel lines. Such are available from Russell for about $165, about the same
cost as OEM replacements. As the MagSab page points out, if you pick up a set of Russells, be sure the
banjo fittings are correctly positioned on the lines so that there is no tendency for the lines to want to twist
when installed. If an apparent twisting problem is noted, return them for another set. Also, you can make
your own set of braided hoses using AN-3 line and appropriate fittings.

Ignition
As the MagSab page describes, the V65 ignition system is often referred to as a CDI (capacitor discharge
ignition), but is actually a more advanced transistorized system. There are basically two separate
systems, one for cylinders 1 & 3, and one for cylinders 2 & 4, with the major components of each being
the pulse generator, spark unit, and coil. Base timing is determined by a protrusion (reluctor) on the
starter clutch as it passes the pulse generators. The MagSab page relates that the 1-3 cylinder spark unit
controls the tach, so if power is down and the tach is misbehaving, the 1-3 unit is the culprit.

Bruce Bennett experienced a failed spark unit at 69k miles. He notes that the units are easy to check:
"Cylinders 2 & 4 dead? Swap units. 2 & 4 now work, and 1 & 3 are dead? Unit bad."

The MagSab page also recalls a report of a coil that tested good when checked via the test procedure in
the Honda manual, but tested bad at dealer's shop. Thus, if you should have problems with the firing of 1-
3 or 2-4 cylinders and it isn't the spark units, it might be a good idea to have the coils tested by a qualified
shop.

Ignition System Mods

In a brief magazine blurb, a V65 Sabre owner reports a dramatic increase in performance just from
swapping in aftermarket Andrews coils, and Accel Superpro 7 ignition wires. He then goes on to say, "it
was literally as if carb jetting and valve and ignition timing had been off all along and were now suddenly
spot on". Maybe his stock coils, plugs, wires, were a little off to begin with.

Tom F. reports having experimented with Accel high performance coils on his friend's dyno, and noticed
absolutely no difference over stock. He claims that Accel even discourages replacement of functional
stock coils.

Most hotrodders know that there's not much to be gained from an ignition system swap unless the factory
system is poor to begin with. Either you have a good spark (and proper timing) or you don't. The V65
ignition seems to do the job just fine from idle clean up to redline. Any other reports?

Ignition Switch
At around 40k miles, the ignition switch on my `83 V45 Magna failed. The internal contacts were dirty. A
mere wiggle of the key would cause the engine to shut off. I was about to purchase a new switch, but
decided to pull apart the old one first. If my memory serves me correctly, I had to pry it apart, but once I
did, I was able to clean all the internal contacts. I crimped it back together, and it worked excellent.

I noticed that aftermarket replacement ignition switches are available from J.C. Whitney and other
catalogs for 500, 700, 750 Magnas, etc., but not V65s.

Load Capacity
The maximum load capacity of the V65 Magna is 370 lbs., while the capacity of the V65 Sabre is 410 lbs.
I suspect that this difference has to do with the fact that the Sabre has a rear hydraulic mono-shock that
can be pressurized from 0-57 psi, vs. the Magna's meager twin side springers. From experience, I can
say that the Magna will handle nearly 350 lbs. quite well. Comments?

Sal Diliberto (`84 V65 Magna) apparently tows a Bushtec trailer. Trailer info?

Mpg
The average of the magazine test article mpg measurements is about 39 mpg. The figures that came in
from the owner responses ranged from 32 to 50 mpg. The most common average numbers were from 38
- 42 mpg, in line with the magazine tests. This is also the range that my own bikes fall between. Many
expect their Magna fuel lights to pop on around the 150 mile mark, which makes sense.

As most probably know, accessories such as a large windshield, fat saddlebags, etc., make a noticeable
dent in mpg. Also, pulling wheelies at every stop light, and hitting warp 3 every time there's a quarter mile
stretch ahead will certainly yield less mpg than if just delicately skating along the highway.

I noticed that travelling at high speeds cuts mileage down significantly. Normally my Magna (with
windshield/saddlebags) will yield about 42 mpg when travelling at 60 mph. However, when travelling at a
steady 85+ mph, I am lucky to yield 34 mpg. Other owners report the same experience/results.

Rear End Unit

Gaylon G. experienced a failed rear differential unit at 40k miles. It cost $500 to replace with a used rear.
Gaylon had been using Honda gear oil, and now uses Spectro synthetic gear oil.

The Honda manual recommends a rear end oil change interval of 24k. However, as cheap insurance,
many enthusiasts recommend a much shorter interval, such as 8k or less. Changing the rear end oil is
very easy to do, and the rear only takes about 60 cents worth of regular 80W-90 gear oil.

Rear Suspension / Shocks

Unlike the dual external rear spring-shock arrangement on Magnas, Sabres utilize a hydraulic mono-
shock. These units are considered "unrepairable".

Ken St.Amant experienced oil leakage from his unit, but was able to find a good used one to replace.
Ernest Kenny experienced oil leakage from his unit, but found a Honda dealer in Murfreesboro, TN, that
was able to repair it. (1-800-342-1681, or 615-893-0150) According to Ernest, they did a great job for only
$85, a heck of lot cheaper than the cost of a new unit which is about $500.

Also, as Ray T. has pointed out, check page 28 of the 1/96 issue of MCN. There's an article about rear
mono-shock rebuilds by Lindemann Engineering. The writer explains how the shock in his VF750F
Interceptor was getting tired, but Lindemann performed an "oil transfusion", and brought it back to life...
for only $60 plus shipping. Lindemann Engineering 520 McGlincy Ln. #3, Campell, CA 95008.

As with front forks, I recommend keeping the air pressure in the rear mono-shock as low as possible for
increased seal life. It seems that many who keep the pressure very high experience failures. The
recommended pressure range for the Sabre rear shock is 0-57 psi... there's a big difference between 0
and 57 psi. I mostly ride solo with very little load on my Sabre. I find the bike rides excellent with between
0 - 5 psi, especially over the relentless NYC potholes. In addition, keeping a lower air pressure in the
shock and forks will ultimately yield a slightly lower ride height, which may be desirable for those with
shorter legs.

John Knepp recommends using Amsoil synthetic grease when lubricating the rear suspension... "the
Amsoil doesn't wash out like regular grease". John notes that disassembling the rear suspension linkage
in order to grease is "a pain". Does anyone know of an easier way to lube the rear suspension linkage,
swing arm, etc.? The manuals are not clear on this.

Concerning Magna rear shocks, many complain of excessive stiffness. Many have sought softer rear
shocks, but from what I have heard, all aftermarket shocks that have been tried have yielded the same or
even stiffer response than the stockers. Keith Mazelin has reported satisfaction with a set of Konis. Can
anyone recommend a good specifically "soft" aftermarket shock for the Magna?

I often carry a passenger and heavy load on my Magna, and keep my rear shock settings weak to reduce
stiffness. I'll occasionally bottom out in the shock travel, but mildly. It's tolerable. So, if you don't like the
stiffness, and aren't ready to try aftermarket shocks, try weakening the adjustments considerably, and
experiment. You'd be surprised at how weak you can adjust the suspension without problems.

Gaylon G. experienced "rough and sticking" Magna rear shocks at 70k miles, and they now need
replacing.

Rpm / Over-Revving / Rev Limiters

One day, my friend and I engaged in a friendly street race on our old V45 Magnas. While my friend was
accelerating at full throttle, the tranny popped out of 2nd gear into neutral. The engine revved straight past
redline, then shut off. Surprisingly, the engine did not suffer any damage. The engine started up, and after
a little bit of coughing, it ran perfect.

The next day, we explained the story to a Honda dealer who claimed that V45s/65s have a built in two-
stage rev limiter. "At roughly 11,000 rpm, the first stage begins to limit the rpm from climbing any higher.
But if the engine should shoot up to around 13,000 rpm, the second stage shuts off the engine."

However, I recently met a friendly fellow who told me how he damaged the engine of his brand new V45
Sabre by over-revving (he "missed a shift upwards of 9,000 rpm"). He said that "a lot of valves got bent,
but the engine was repairable". $700 later, his dealer got the thing running again. This sounds to me like
the result of either a thrown cam chain, or perhaps just severe valve float. Rev-limiter?
Perhaps the dealer I spoke with was wrong, and V65s/V45s do NOT have a built in rev limiter...? An
article in Motorcyclist about hopping up an early `80's VF750 Interceptor recommends adding a K/V rev-
limiter. Why would they recommend a rev-limiter if the bike already had one. ? Does anyone know
whether or not the V65 has a built in rev-limiter?

I have not yet heard of any V45s/65s throwing a connecting rod, or experiencing any catastrophic lower
end failures from over revving. Has anyone else?

What is considered over-revving on a V45/65? First, the red "danger" zone on the tach gauge begins at
10,000 rpm and the gauge ends at 11,000 rpm. The V45 and V65 owner's manual says "do not exceed
8,000 rpm when running the engine without a load... do not exceed 10,000 rpm at any time". I'll add that
it's probably a lot more dangerous to run the engine near 8,000 rpm without a load, than to run it to
10,000 rpm with a load. I personally have pulled maybe two near 11,000 rpm shifts in my day... not
intentionally. No troubles were encountered. It is recommended to keep the revs under 9,000 rpm, unless
you're really going for that record breaking e.t.

When I obtained my very first real motorcycle years ago (a V45), I was afraid to rev past 6,000 rpm, stuck
in an automotive V-8 state of mind. I had been so used to race shifting my 455 Pontiac at 5,200 rpm, that
it was hard to imagine shifting any vehicle at 9,000 rpm. Fortunately, a mad hotrodder friend of mine
coaxed me into unleashing the beast. If anyone out there has not yet experienced a V65 6,000-9,000 rpm
acceleration, do so NOW. Don't be afraid. Go to a safe, flat, barren place. Prepare for serious G-forces.
Be sure to always be watching the road WAY ahead, because you'll be there in a blink. Remember that it
takes less than seven seconds reach three-digit speeds. As my friend refers to it, "scary-fast", or as
scientists refer to it, "warp speed". Enjoy.

Saddlebags: Hardbags
The most sought after V65 Sabre accessory is the original Hondaline hardbag set-up. I think I've only
seen a hardbag equipped V65 Sabre once in my lifetime. I have seen several V45 Sabres with this option
however. I wonder if it's difficult to modify the V45 set up to fit the V65?

Kurt Grife didn't let the scarceness of the Honda hardbags get him down, and instead fetched a pair of
Kawasaki Concours side hardbags. Kurt fabricated his own mounting system to attach the Kawi trunks to
the Sabre. Looks and works great! (See photo of Kurt's Sabre) For those who wish to obtain Sabre
hardbags, you might want to consider a custom set-up as Kurt's, since originals could take years to
locate.

Concerning the Sabre hardbags, it appears that other Hondas of the early `80's, such as CBXs and
Silverwings, came with similar type hardbags. Maybe they're the same? For those who have never used
hardbags and wish to obtain them, you may want to consider soft bags instead. Softbags can easily be
compressed when you need to squeeze through a tight spot. Plus, with soft bags, there's less plastic to
scratch and break in case of a mild mishap. A soft bag actually acts as a safety cushion in a stationary tip
over, and will suffer little or no damage. Be sure to carry your camera in your tankbag though. Softbags
are also lighter, and can ultimately hold more.

Spark Plugs
The Honda manual recommends changing the spark plugs every 4k miles. This short change interval is
because each plug fires twice per cycle, twice as many times than with conventional ignition systems.
However, it seems that you can get more than 4k miles out of the plugs without trouble. Since
"motorcycle" plugs are often expensive, many try to stretch the limit. Gaylon G. suggests that plugs can
work fine up to 20k miles.

I, and others, have noticed that if you leave the plugs in for a longer than recommended time, that once
you do change them, it seems that performance suddenly becomes a bit more "sparky" (no pun
intended). John Knepp notices an improvement in performance when changing the plugs at 4k miles,
even though the old ones come out looking new. This suggests that performance may indeed suffer a bit
when running "worn" plugs. With this in mind, perhaps it is a good idea to change them not too long after
the recommended interval. The extra performance may be worth the few extra bucks.

It's a good idea to use a bit of high heat lubricant such as Permatex anti-seize on the plug threads. Also,
I've noticed that sometimes, after a while, the plugs will loosen up. After installing new plugs, recheck the
torque a few hundred miles later.

I usually use NGKs, and have tried NDs a few times... never had a problem. I always use the "colder"
version NGK DRP9EA-9, as opposed to the DRP8EA-9, and the plugs always come out properly colored
without excessive deposits.

David Hickey Jr. notes that his lower bank cylinder plugs (2 & 4) come out darker and wetter that the other
two, which could be due to one of several reasons. Has anyone else experienced this? If so, what's your
theory/findings?

Make sure the plug boots are sealed to the ignition wires. I recommend applying a light coating of black
silicon sealer where the boot meets the wire, especially on the two front cylinders. I had an experience
where water found its way between the boot and wire, shorting the plug. It was upsetting to suddenly
encounter a nasty miss while being tailgated by a trailer truck on an interstate in the rain. I've heard of
another Magna owner who experienced the exact same problem. Incidentally, my quick fix that day was to
first dry the plug and boot, then tie a piece of material around the wire in front of the boot. It worked fine
until I was able to repair it properly.

Use dielectric grease inside the boots and around the plug connection. This will keep the boot from
sticking, plus maintain a good connection, reducing arcing tendencies.

Spark Plug Wires

The following is borrowed directly from the MagSab FAQ pages by Trenton Shoeb.

"You can replace the wires in the plug leads. Copper wire is the best; the only reason for the use of
resistive type wires is to reduce ignition noise pickup in the radio, and all the fancy electronics in the
average new cage. Resistive type wires reduce the intensity of the spark, ie. restrict the current flow.
Unscrew the compression sleeve that holds the plug wire in place in the coil. There is an O-ring on the
wire; remove and save it. There is a slot in the fitting that pushes over the threaded end of the spark plug,
loosen it with a screw driver and remove it from the plug end. You can push the wire out through the
rubber plug cap. Unsolder the brass washer from the wire. Cut a new piece of copper core ignition wire to
the same length as the old wire +1/4" . Strip back the insulation and solder the brass washer onto the
wire. Feed the wire back through the plug end and reassemble. Put the compression fitting on the other
end and replace the O-ring. Smear a bit of dielectric grease inside the plug fitting; this makes it much
easier to remove later. Don't forget to check the old plugs for carbon tracks on the insulator. Nothing
worse for a good spark than a conductive boot. You can replace the spark plug boots with NGK p/n
SD05F and XD05F."
Speedometer Sender
Unlike the mechanical cable on Magnas, Sabres use an electric speedometer pick-up sender (at the front
axle). Ernest Kenny has had to replace three of these units, and recommends applying a good coat of
silicon grease to the unit to prevent corrosion.

Starter
Gaylon G. finds his starter motor turning slow at 70k miles.

Ray T. relays that if the starter is running slow, and the battery and all connections are in good order, you
should rebuild the starter. "Pull the starter, making sure the bike is on its sidestand, not centerstand,
otherwise you'll spill nearly a quart of oil. Check the brushes and commutator. Clean the glaze off the
commutator... do not use emery paper. Clean out any copper dust, etc., from between the segments.
Reassembling the starter and trying to pull back the four brushes with one hand while holding back the
armature with the other hand can be difficult if alone. It will help if you can pull the brush springs back and
clip them over the sides or use a pin to keep them out of the way. (the manuals offer info too).

Some owners have suggested to make sure the cable connection at the starter is clean and lubricated to
avoid poor starter performance and cable meltdown.

Jack Hart once had to replace a starter relay switch on a V65... the only V65 problem he ever
encountered in over 200k miles of riding V65s.

Steering Head Bearings

Robert T. replaced the steering head bearings on his `85 V65 Sabre at about 100k miles when he started
experiencing a strong "detent" feel with the fork in the straight ahead position. Rob replaced the original
ball bearings with roller bearings from Cycles Unlimited (Eldon Rix) R.R. #2 Pryor, OK 74361. The roller
bearings are "much better", and cost only $52 including shipping. Stock ball bearings are about $75.
These roller bearings fit many other model bikes too.

Rob describes replacing the steering head bearings as a "big job". He mentioned that the handle of his
floor jack happened to serve as the perfect sized punch for driving on the lower race.

Tool Kit, Original Oem

As several enthusiasts have pointed out, you may wish to swap some of the original Honda tools of your
OEM tool kit for some higher quality tools. Always expect to have to service the bike in the middle of
nowhere... a few good tools could mean the difference between getting yourself going right away, or being
stranded for hours.

As several enthusiasts have pointed out, do not try to remove the rear wheel axle nut with the OEM
wrench provided in the bike kit. You will only wreck the nut.

Don't forget extra fuses, a spark plug, a tire puncture kit, and a taillight bulb.
Top Speed
Mid-late `80's editions of the Guinness Book of World Records list the V65 Magna as the world's fastest
production road motorcycle with a "design speed" of 173 mph. Magazine test articles have calculated that
a theoretical redline in top gear would yield between 173 and 184 mph. Many test articles have measured
actual V65 Sabre and Magna top speeds at around 135-140 mph. Most enthusiasts wrote in claiming to
have reached 120- 140 mph, 130 mph being most common... except for 75 year old Jack Hart who claims
160+ mph! Right on, Jack!

Transmission Problems
Ray T. had to replace 6th, 5th, and 2nd gear in his `84 Sabre, after experiencing a 6th gear that tended to
disengage by itself. The four gears (6th, 5th, and both 2nds) cost $270 back in 1991. Ray noted that by
properly shimming the gears, shifting was improved.

Jim Lehman owned an `83 and owns an `84 Magna, both of which lost 2nd gear, but Jim confesses he's a
wheelie-king.

Len Puma bought a complete `83 V65 Magna for $100... stuck in 2nd gear however.

At 26k miles, Keith Mazelin had to replace the 1st gear shift fork, and 1st, 2nd, and 3rd gears of his `83
Magna... about $400-450 with the dealer doing all the work, installing used parts from a salvaged motor.
At 60k, Keith had to replace the two "large shift forks", and 1st, 2nd, and 3rd gears again... about $700
with mechanic doing the internal work, new parts, but Keith pulled and installed engine from the frame
himself. Apparently, the 1983-`85 V65s did not have the best designed 2nd gear, as several owners have
had to replace. Honda changed (improved) the gear design after 1985. If you look at the specs in the
official Honda Magna manual, you'll note that the 2nd and 3rd gear ratios are different for 1986
applications. Also, Ray T. reports that when he purchased 2nd gear for his `84 Sabre, he had to get "both
gears, since Honda changed the shape of the gear teeth since the production of the bike, the teeth now
being shorter and fatter".

Rusty Marcotte reports that the transmission of his V65 Sabre "locks up", becomes stuck in gear when
hot. Shifts again once cool.

The MagSab page notes that a gearshift failure is likely due to a broken gear shift arm spring. More info
on the net.

Transmission / Shifting
Most V65 Magnas/Sabres I've ridden have finicky transmissions. Sometimes they shift smooth as butter,
other times they just refuse to go into gear.

The trannys will always behave better with lighter oil (10W-40 opposed to 20W-50). Also, higher quality
motorcycle oil seems to provide smoother shifts than regular automotive oil. Many feel that synthetic oil
makes a noticeable improvement above all. As Thomas Blooming points out, be sure the shift linkage is
properly lubricated. It shouldn't bind, or be too sloppy.

Be sure the clutch hydraulic system is in good working order, and that the hydraulic line is air-free. For `85
and up Magna models, be sure the clutch lever adjustment is set properly.
Retired mechanic Jack Hart offers the following procedure to help obtain smooth shifts: "Squeeze the
clutch lever all the way in and click it in to 1st gear. Run the bike up to the desired speed, and squeeze
the clutch lever all the way in. Put a small amount of pressure on the shifter and run the engine up to the
same speed as the transmission. At this point, the tranny will slip right into second gear. Use the same
procedure for 3rd, 4th, 5th, and 6th."

Jim Hedrick offers the following tip for obtaining smooth shifts: "apply slight pressure on the shift lever
BEFORE pulling in the clutch."

Whether upshifting or downshifting, I find that the following always applies... after pulling in the clutch,
never try to force it into gear, but instead apply light pressure to the shift lever, and after a few seconds it
will effortlessly slip into gear. This is basically what Jack Hart has described, and it indeed applies to all
V4s I've ridden. But, remember to not press the shifter too lightly, because you may experience a mild
"gear grind" sound. Also, sometimes this technique doesn't work well from 6th to 5th, as it seems more
often than not, a "gear grind" sound will be experienced. From 6th to 5th, it may be better to press down
with more authority. From 5th on down though, this "light pressure for a few seconds with the clutch in"
method will be helpful.

If you're stopped at a light, the bike in neutral, you can get it into 1st by pulling in the clutch, and rolling
the bike several inches while pressing lightly on the shift lever.

Do not try to downshift to 1st until you're nearly about to stop, even if you do NOT intend to re-engage the
clutch before stopping. If you wish to drop into first while still travelling relatively fast, rev up the engine to
match the rpm that would normally be encountered in 1st, just as if you were going to let out the clutch at
that speed. Otherwise, a loud unpleasant clunk will be experienced. Of course, needless to say, if you
were to drop to first at a high speed and engage the clutch, you'd be yanked into a rapid deceleration. The
safety sprag clutch design of the V65 would then come into play to prevent a wild skid-out.

Also, if you happen to pop into a state of neutral while travelling relatively fast, be sure to get the rpms up
before shifting back into gear, or, as above, a nasty clunk will be experienced upon pressing the shift
lever.

Now and then, when accelerating hard and shifting fast, if I fail to click 6th gear in with conviction, it will go
into 6th, then pop right out, and enter a limbonic state of neutral between 5th and 6th. Other V65 owners
have reported the same experience.

Trike Kit Vehicle, V65

Don Poremski is planning on building a V65 powered custom three-wheeled vehicle. The project is based
on a trike kit that was available in the late `70's called "Tri-Magnum", and a similar kit called "Fire Aero".
The vehicle will have two wheels in front, one in the rear. A V65 Magna frame/engine becomes the rear
portion of the vehicle, and is attached to the front half through the bike's goose neck tube, strengthened
by runners back to the lower portions of the frame. Chevette front axle. Tri-Magnum had the kit builder
fashion his own body from fiberglass, much like the old balsa wood model airplanes using sheets of foam
for tissue paper, then glassing both the inner and outer surfaces. Don will do the same, and is going for
more of a classic car look for the front, with tandem seating, not side by side. Imagine an old Delahaye or
Bugatti with its bulbous fenders, place those on either side of a rather aeronautical fuselage which
extends rearward to cover the bike portion, and there you have it.

Don is still currently in search of a "junker" V65 Magna to use for the project. Though Don only needs the
rear half with good running engine, he would prefer to obtain an entire bike... forks need not be straight.
Don also welcomes snail-mail or E-mail from anyone who is interested in the project.
Turn Signals
Several enthusiasts have reported failed "blinker" units. An enthusiasts once told me he was able to get a
replacement Japanese auto blinker unit that fit, for half the price of the Honda cycle part. Any part
numbers?

Recently, the turn signal system failed on my `85 Magna. One of the first test procedures is to short the
blinker unit to ground to see whether or not the blinker unit itself is good. I shorted the unit, hit the switch,
and the signals worked. The blinker was fine, and apparently, something in the self-canceling system was
ill. After more troubleshooting, I still couldn't pinpoint the problem. The wiring diagram in my Clymer
manual didn't exactly match the wires on the bike... close, but not close enough. I also came to realize
that an electronic module from Honda was going to be expensive. To avoid further headaches, I simply
"permanently" grounded the blinker unit with the "test" wire, bypassing the self-canceling system. The
signals now work fine, but must be canceled manually.

Valve Adjustments
In my opinion, the most undesirable aspect of the V65 is the recommended valve adjustment every 8k
miles, as described in the Honda manual. If you ride a lot, you might find yourself performing this tedious
task nearly twice a year.

If you should choose to have your valves done at a shop, there can be problems. One, it's a fairly
expensive job. Two, you never know whether or not the work was actually performed, or whether or not
the mechanic actually took the time to carefully measure and adjust each of the 16 clearances. As it is,
clearances are often out by only.001" - .002", and if a mechanic does a rush job, his work might be
inaccurate by .001" anyway. I've heard of two accounts where V4 owners brought their bikes in for
adjustment, and they were nearly sure their mechanic didn't even open the engine. Recommendation: if
you are going to have the work done by someone, ONLY go to a highly experienced mechanic, preferably
at a Honda dealer, and try to stop around when they are supposed to perform the work... be sure they
don't just dust off the valve covers, and hand you a large bill.

Some feel that it is not necessary to adjust the valves every 8k miles. Ken St.Amant has nearly 28k on his
last adjustment, and his bike is running excellent. David Hickey Jr.'s Sabre is also running fine with 42k on
the odo... the valves have never been adjusted. Then there are some who proclaim you must adjust the
valves every 5k miles or less to avoid catastrophe.

I rip my valve covers off every 10k miles. After originally doing it faithfully at 8k, I found that the clearances
never changed that much. Waiting that extra 2k can sometime get me to the end of the season. Anyhow,
I've never experienced clearances out by more than .002"... usually just off by .001".

Many believe that clearances can only grow due to wear at the valve tips and rocker adjusters. This does
take place, but the clearances can also shrink due to valve recession. So, there's a reason for both
growth and shrinkage of the clearances. Which occurs faster? After performing many adjustments, I
cannot come to any conclusion. At each adjustment, I find some clearances that have grown, some that
have shrunk.

If the clearances should be a bit on the loose side, this is O.K. However, if the clearances are on the tight
side, there's a risk of the valves running hot due to a reduced "seated" time, which can lead to a burnt
valve.
If you haven't performed a valve adjustment in a long time, and would like to do a quick check without
opening the engine, just perform a simple compression test. If your findings are noticeably below spec,
clearances may be too tight. If the readings are noticeably high, the clearances may be too loose.

Valve "ticking" noise is normal, even when the valves are properly adjusted. Such noise will be more
pronounced when cold. Most mechanics will suggest that you only be concerned if you do not hear valve
noise. However, if you should detect an abnormally loud ticking sound, grab a compression tester and do
some investigating.

Warm Up
As Ray T. has related, a mechanic once witnessed that it took over two minutes for cold oil to reach the
cylinder head area of a V65 after an initial cold start-up. Anything to help get the oil to circulate quicker will
be beneficial.

I have made a motorcycle engine heater from an old electric space heater by modifying the housing to
allow it to lay flat. In 50 degree or lower temperatures, I simply slip the heater underneath the engine and
turn it on about 30 minutes before starting the engine. It really helps. The engine cranks fast, starts right
up, and warms quickly. Since the heater is placed close to the oil filter and oil pan, the oil gets warmed
well, and thus will circulate much better.

The only danger in using such an "under-engine heater", would be if any oil were to leak from the engine
onto the heater, a serious fire could result. Needless to say, always check very carefully before using such
a heater.

Though the Honda owner's manual says to begin riding after the temp gauge "exceeds the blue (cold)
mark" which can take a pretty long time in cold weather, I like to do the following instead: after starting the
engine (choke on), let it idle for a minute max. Then, even though the temp gauge will still read cold, put
the bike in gear, and start riding. However, keep the bike in first gear only, be gentle on the throttle, and
keep engine speed around 2000 rpm or so. Once rolling, disengage the choke completely. Continue to
ride around slowly until the temp gauge indicates correct operating temperature. Do not allow the engine
to experience any load during this warm-up time.

Some owners like to let the bike sit and idle only until it has reached full operating temperature. On cold
days, this can take nearly ten minutes. The oil pump may not supply an adequate amount of oil to all
areas (cams, etc.) when merely idling. Plus, when the engine is idling, there is no load on the pistons,
rods, etc., and thus they shake and rock freely causing excessive wear. Being that the choke must remain
on for a while at idle, and because the engine runs in an unstable manner at idle, more fuel is introduced
into the cylinders, much of which does not get burnt during combustion. This extra raw fuel is now
available to wash oil from the cylinder walls. Also, due to less than optimum ring sealing at idle, excessive
amounts of fuel contaminants will reach the crankcase too. To top it off, the manual reminds us that the
charging system does not charge the battery below 1,100 rpm.

While this negative view about idling may seem harsh, remember that you may cause your engine to idle
over 100 hours in 50k miles if you were to allow a ten minute idlewarm-up each start. This of course does
not even count the idling you'll experience in traffic, etc. It would definitely be beneficial to cut those idling
hours down.

Other owners like to warm up the engine by revving it repeatedly to 7,000 rpm in neutral. While this may
get the oil pump to deliver lots of oil, it is also putting a big strain on all internal parts, especially since the
parts are cold and clearances not yet correct. In addition, the cold thick oil may still not flow fast enough to
adequately satisfy the high stress of high revving parts. The oil filter bypass will most likely stay open
under the pressure of syrup thick oil at 7,000 rpm. Revving the engine in neutral, whether cold or hot, can
only do harm.

By riding along gently at 1,500-2,500 rpm, no strain, yet no excessive idling is encountered. Plus, you can
open the choke fast because the engine will not stall if you're just rolling along holding the throttle open at
2,000 rpm without a strain.

To support the above, Robert Sikorsky states in his book, Drive It Forever, "...most engineers agree that
prolonged idling of a cold engine will only do harm... a cold idling engine won't warm up as fast, lubricate
as efficiently, or burn gasoline as completely as one that is in gear and moving... under load".

Water Pump
Gaylon G. experienced a failed (leaking) water pump at 50k miles. Replacing the coolant at the
recommended intervals will help prolong water pump life.

Wheels
All 1982-`83 Magnas (including the `83 V65) came with "5-point star" aluminum finish wheels. As Len
Puma points out, the front wheels appear to be the same for the V45 and V65, but the rears are different,
since the V65 uses a disc brake, the V45 a drum. In 1984, all Magnas switched to slightly different style
wheels, a "5-box" shape, with a shiny chrome finish as opposed to aluminum. Also with these wheels, it
appears that they are interchangeable between the V65 and VF700 bikes. I've also seen Shadows of the
era wearing what appears to be the same style Magna type front wheels. Maybe a different size though?
Anyone?

I'm unsure about the Sabres. Apparently `84 and `85 V65 Sabres share the same wheels, a "3-point star"
shape, aluminum finish. I believe that the `82 - `85 smaller Sabres also share the same front wheel with
the V65s. I do know that the front rim size is the same for V45 and V65 Sabres. Anyone?

The above "cross-reference" info is good to know if you should ever need a front rim for a V65. A used rim
from a V45 will probably be cheaper and easier to locate than a used rim from a V65.

As the MagSab page points out, it is not uncommon for rim corrosion at the bead seal areas to become
bad enough to cause chronic air leaks. An inner tube can be used to remedy such leaks, but is not
recommended. (see FINISH)

Wheel Bearings
At 60k miles, Gaylon G. experienced slack and roughness in the wheel bearings of his Magna, and thus
replaced them.

The rear wheel bearing in Ken St.Amant's `85 Sabre started making noise at less than 28k, so Ken
replaced it, costing close to $300. Ken mentioned that there was a "service bulletin on the GL1200
Goldwing for the same problem (similar wheel), but it doesn't cover the Sabre".

Sources Of Parts Recommended By V65 Enthusiasts

Banzai Motorsports 1-800-405-SAVE (discount OEM and more)
Chaparral Motorsports 1-800-841-2960 (discount aftermarket, free catalog)
Classic Japanese Motorcycle Club Newsletter (CJMN) 358 St Julie Dr. San Jose, CA 95119 408-225-
3274 (used and unique)
Competition Accessories 1-800-543-3535 (discount aftermarket and some OEM)
Dale Walker's Holeshot Performance 320 Babe T. Rd., La Selva, CA 95076 408-761-2808 (specialty)
Dennis Kirk 1-800-328-9280 (discount aftermarket, free catalog)
J.C. Whitney 2319 S. Throop St., P.O. Box 8410 Chicago, IL 60680 312-431-6102
Motorcycle Shopper Annual Salvage Directory, ($5) 407-574-1989
Willie's Cycle Sales, Alabama 1-800-334-4045