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ASR, PIC , SPC, NRG, ST, Mugen, Tanabe, Energy Suspension, & more - Honda-Tech
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Hiper Suspension Up ! ASR, PIC , SPC , NRG, ST, Mugen , Tanabe, Energy
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08-31-2007 , 10 :55 PM
Guam_CiviC619
#1
Hiper Suspension Up ! ASR, PIC , SPC, NRG, ST, Mugen , Tanabe, Energy Suspension, & more
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3/15/2010 10:47:11 PM
Hiper Suspension Up ! ASR, PIC , SPC, NRG, ST, Mugen, Tanabe, Energy Suspension, & more - Honda-Tech
Page 2
08 -31-2007 ,
11 :06 PM
#2
Guam_
CiviC619
Member
Join Date:
Jul 2002
Location:
Chula Juana
619, CA ,
You Es Of A
Posts : 1, 235
09-01-2007 , 02 :07 AM
#3
bmoua
Member
somebody is balling.....haha
GL with the build bro
http://www.honda-tech.com/showthread.php?t=2085886
3/15/2010 10:47:11 PM
Hiper Suspension Up ! ASR, PIC , SPC, NRG, ST, Mugen, Tanabe, Energy Suspension, & more - Honda-Tech
Page 3
09-01-2007 , 03 :59 PM
mullet eater
#4
Re: (bmoua)
Junior Member
09 -02-2007 ,
11 :27 PM
Guam_
CiviC619
Member
Join Date:
Jul 2002
Location:
Chula Juana
619, CA ,
You Es Of A
Posts : 1, 235
#5
Re: Hiper Suspension Up ! ASR, PIC , SPC, NRG, ST , Mugen, Tanabe, Energy Suspension, & more (Guam_ C
Ok the long awaited update. With the vehicle in its previous state (Weapon -R Dual Spring Circuit Pro Coilovers, KYB AGX) the car
felt under damped since day one , around late 2002. The cars handling was improved but ride quality suffered substantially. Later
on I added an eBay front lower tie bar, and shortly after that DC rear upper and lower bars. The car felt more solid but it could be
improved even further. Understeer was still a characteristic but not as extreme as a stock DX . This was acceptable until that damn
shock blew .
With the blown shock the cars handling was twitchy and prone to rear wander . On big holes or bumps you could hear the wheel
bounce several times before it settled. I dunno how we drove so long like that ? It was well worth the wait though
Here are most of the parts for this install.
http://www.honda-tech.com/showthread.php?t=2085886
3/15/2010 10:47:11 PM
Hiper Suspension Up ! ASR, PIC , SPC, NRG, ST, Mugen, Tanabe, Energy Suspension, & more - Honda-Tech
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My knuckles. Sandblasted, primed with Zinc Rich, 1st coat VHT Caliper Paint, 2nd coat Dupl-Color Engine Enamel. OEM wheel
bearings, studs and lower ball joint pressed. New dust shield as well .
http://www.honda-tech.com/showthread.php?t=2085886
3/15/2010 10:47:11 PM
Hiper Suspension Up ! ASR, PIC , SPC, NRG, ST, Mugen, Tanabe, Energy Suspension, & more - Honda-Tech
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I wish PIC would spend a little more on their packaging . Theres too much room for movement and a disgruntled UPS worker
wouldnt have a hard time tweaking an adjustment knob out of wack, rendering the coilover useless. As a matter of fact, one of
mine was tweaked a couple of degrees off center axis, but functionally is unnoticeable. HKS vs. PIC vs K Sport packaging.
http://www.honda-tech.com/showthread.php?t=2085886
3/15/2010 10:47:11 PM
Hiper Suspension Up ! ASR, PIC , SPC, NRG, ST, Mugen, Tanabe, Energy Suspension, & more - Honda-Tech
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Old Setup.
Blown.
http://www.honda-tech.com/showthread.php?t=2085886
3/15/2010 10:47:11 PM
Hiper Suspension Up ! ASR, PIC , SPC, NRG, ST, Mugen, Tanabe, Energy Suspension, & more - Honda-Tech
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3/15/2010 10:47:11 PM
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I wanted to clean it up a little for disassembly so I could sell the coilovers on eBay. I used brake cleaner and the paint started to
strip off of the shock . I don t know if its the shock oil, road grime, or combination, but this is the result so AGX owners, beware of
brake cleaner .
While I was tearing everything down this thing pulled up just long enough for me to snap a couple photos. The shop recommended
http://www.honda-tech.com/showthread.php?t=2085886
3/15/2010 10:47:11 PM
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http://www.honda-tech.com/showthread.php?t=2085886
3/15/2010 10:47:11 PM
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Tech tip. This was the 1 st snag I ran into. Getting the new clamp for the air equalizer hose on the steering boots . The clamp is very
difficult to pinch with your fingers or pliers without watching it fly somewhere. I was going to put a new hose as well , but this is
nearly impossible without dropping the steering rack.
http://www.honda-tech.com/showthread.php?t=2085886
3/15/2010 10:47:11 PM
Hiper Suspension Up ! ASR, PIC , SPC, NRG, ST, Mugen, Tanabe, Energy Suspension, & more - Honda-Tech
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Use a 4 mm allen wrench to keep the clamp in a manageable position. Then use pliers to slip it on while holding the clamp on the
edge of the hose. Slip the hose on the nipple. Cake.
http://www.honda-tech.com/showthread.php?t=2085886
3/15/2010 10:47:11 PM
Hiper Suspension Up ! ASR, PIC , SPC, NRG, ST, Mugen, Tanabe, Energy Suspension, & more - Honda-Tech
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The second snag came with my ST front bar. They sent me a bar for an Si/EX. Bastards. So this piece will have to wait for later .
Heres the SPC and Ingalls camber kits compared to their stock counterparts. You will note that the front camber arm is longer than
the factory piece. This is why people will tell you not get one if youre planning to go low with your ride, because the tips may end
up smacking the top of your shock tower. I got mine because it comes with greaseable poly bushings via zerk fittings, I wanted to
be able to dial in camber, and they are beefier. I got the rear for the same reasons, although they are not greaseable.
http://www.honda-tech.com/showthread.php?t=2085886
3/15/2010 10:47:11 PM
Hiper Suspension Up ! ASR, PIC , SPC, NRG, ST, Mugen, Tanabe, Energy Suspension, & more - Honda-Tech
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3/15/2010 10:47:11 PM
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Tech tip 3. If you follow this guide for your rear trailing arm, http://www.honda -tech.com/zerothread?id=1589298 , it will tell you
to remove the toe adjustment bolt. I found this to be unnecessary , instead I removed the bolt that connects the lower control arm
to the trailing arm. All you have to do is loosen both bolts on the compensator arm (toe adjustment ) then substitute the bolts in the
camber arm with shock bolts to bring the trailing arm out more. Just make sure you thread those long ass bolts far enough for good
thread engagement . This is a better option in my opinion but either method will work. Use whatever suits you best.
http://www.honda-tech.com/showthread.php?t=2085886
3/15/2010 10:47:11 PM
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http://www.honda-tech.com/showthread.php?t=2085886
3/15/2010 10:47:11 PM
Hiper Suspension Up ! ASR, PIC , SPC, NRG, ST, Mugen, Tanabe, Energy Suspension, & more - Honda-Tech
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Front installed. You can see the front of the NRG brace right above the tie rod.
http://www.honda-tech.com/showthread.php?t=2085886
3/15/2010 10:47:11 PM
Hiper Suspension Up ! ASR, PIC , SPC, NRG, ST, Mugen, Tanabe, Energy Suspension, & more - Honda-Tech
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Heres a relic from 1942 that a USMC Captain owns and was working on. Functional and all. The spare wheel and tire is original !
http://www.honda-tech.com/showthread.php?t=2085886
3/15/2010 10:47:11 PM
Hiper Suspension Up ! ASR, PIC , SPC, NRG, ST, Mugen, Tanabe, Energy Suspension, & more - Honda-Tech
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3/15/2010 10:47:11 PM
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I polished my ASR Bar, Function 7 LCAs and repolished my DC lower tie bar, then had them powdercoated clear. Before the
clearcoat.
The ASR Bar was designed for the ITR/CTR D -brackets. So any bolt-on Civic applications will not fit this without special D-brackets,
or fabricating your own. So thats what I did. I used stock Si D -brackets and chopped the tabs off where the holes begin , then
sandblasted them. Then I found some similar gauge steel and shaped it to workable pieces. I had a welder weld on the new tabs. I
http://www.honda-tech.com/showthread.php?t=2085886
3/15/2010 10:47:11 PM
Hiper Suspension Up ! ASR, PIC , SPC, NRG, ST, Mugen, Tanabe, Energy Suspension, & more - Honda-Tech
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then measured the distance of the new holes and made a template on paper, and marked and drilled new holes. I planed the tabs
on a belt sander to get them flush and worked them to something more aesthetically pleasing. I finished them with VHT Caliper
paint.
http://www.honda-tech.com/showthread.php?t=2085886
3/15/2010 10:47:11 PM
Hiper Suspension Up ! ASR, PIC , SPC, NRG, ST, Mugen, Tanabe, Energy Suspension, & more - Honda-Tech
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3/15/2010 10:47:11 PM
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The reason I went with the Tanabe swaybar is because I felt it would be a good match with the ST front bar . Both the Tanabe and
ST pieces are 19mm . Another reason is because I did not like the way the ST bar mounts to the shock towers and they re fricken
green. Also , my wife drives this vehicle 90% of the time so oversteer is not a condition I would want my wife to experience. I plan
to upgrade to a CTR/ITR bar when I take over the vehicle 100 % sometime in the future.
The mock up. Now before you other tuners get your panties in a bunch about the DC bar, I plan to take it off. Although it does add
rigidity, Im not sure how much of an improvement it adds to the already beefy ASR bar. Mostly its there for the same reason
people put on Beaks bars.
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3/15/2010 10:47:11 PM
Hiper Suspension Up ! ASR, PIC , SPC, NRG, ST, Mugen, Tanabe, Energy Suspension, & more - Honda-Tech
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1st drop . The car is off the lift. The coilovers can still be lowered about an inch. Mad camber shot too !
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3/15/2010 10:47:11 PM
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http://www.honda-tech.com/showthread.php?t=2085886
3/15/2010 10:47:11 PM
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I wasnt able to complete the install at the shop as planned, but I have a friend that was willing to let me use his garage and tools
to finish up. ThanX Dan !!
Endlinks installed. I changed the Function 7 hardware to stainless and used cadmium plated 3 /8 spacers to get the proper distance.
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3/15/2010 10:47:11 PM
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http://www.honda-tech.com/showthread.php?t=2085886
3/15/2010 10:47:11 PM
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Night shot.
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Notes: Everything that I could get a torque wrench on was torqued to spec. All bolts with bushings that I could get a torque wrench
on got torqued while the suspension was loaded. Rear swaybar was installed with the suspension loaded. All bushing sleeves were
lined with PTFE teflon tape, with the exception of the camber kits and mugen bushing (duh). Set back #4 , Blox lugnuts were the
wrong size, had to go to Discount tire to get some. I used a suspension specialty shop to swap my front control arm bushings . I still
have my DC rear upper bar.
The ride quality is dramatically improved. The chassis seems more rigid as well. Turn in is crisp. I haven t had a chance to play with
the other damper settings, but Im really liking 1 (softest) so far. The PICs feel very well valved. Without the front swaybar it does
not feel like it is prone to oversteer. The handling is very confidence inspiring all the while feeling very well composed. The car
seems more rigid as well . Although I haven t pushed the limits yet , as I do not want to drive the car without an alignment for very
long.
I want to explore further chassis stiffening. Im going to try either a Js Racing, Alex, or Silk Road front fender brace . Im also going
to buy a Password JDM 3-point front upper strut bar, and if I can get them, Korbach Frame Locks.
Stay tuned, some finale shots are in the works.
09-03-2007 , 03 :40 AM
dizzak
#6
Re: Hiper Suspension Up ! ASR, PIC , SPC, NRG, ST, Mugen, Tanabe, Energy Suspension, & more (Guam_C
Junior Member
Nice!
09 -03-2007 ,
11 :08 AM
http://www.honda-tech.com/showthread.php?t=2085886
#7
3/15/2010 10:47:11 PM
Hiper Suspension Up ! ASR, PIC , SPC, NRG, ST, Mugen, Tanabe, Energy Suspension, & more - Honda-Tech
Guam_
CiviC619
Page 29
Re: Hiper Suspension Up ! ASR, PIC , SPC, NRG, ST , Mugen, Tanabe, Energy Suspension, & more (Guam_ C
Member
Join Date:
Jul 2002
Location:
Chula Juana
619, CA ,
You Es Of A
Posts : 1, 235
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09-03-2007 , 02 :42 PM
http://www.honda-tech.com/showthread.php?t=2085886
#8
3/15/2010 10:47:11 PM
Hiper Suspension Up ! ASR, PIC , SPC, NRG, ST, Mugen, Tanabe, Energy Suspension, & more - Honda-Tech
Brewer
Page 31
Re: Hiper Suspension Up ! ASR, PIC , SPC, NRG, ST, Mugen, Tanabe, Energy Suspension, & more (Guam_C
Senior Member
09-03-2007 , 04 :13 PM
Rusty Shackleferd
#9
Re: Hiper Suspension Up ! ASR, PIC , SPC, NRG, ST, Mugen, Tanabe, Energy Suspension, & more (Guam_C
Member
09-04-2007 , 12 :23 AM
Johnny Mac
#10
Re: Hiper Suspension Up ! ASR, PIC , SPC, NRG, ST, Mugen, Tanabe, Energy Suspension, & more (Guam_C
Member
Why are you using both a DC rear subframe brace AND an ASR brace ? Don 't you know that the ASR brace is all
you need?
_ __ ___ __ ___ __ ___ __
2010 #31 CRX H4 Honda Challenge
2010 #37 Integra H 4 Project Car
AeroRD
09-04-2007 , 04 :00 AM
#11
Guam_CiviC619
Member
I've had the DC bar for several years, not to mention that I put more money into it by getting it repolished and
powdercoated clear. There's sentimental value in it , but it's coming off next weekend. I got the inspiration from
people running the ASR + Beaks.
_ __ ___ __ ___ __ ___ __
Function Before Form, Form Follows Function.
My Suspension Overhaul.
09-04-2007 , 02 :22 PM
94 IntegraLS
#12
Re: (Guam_ CiviC619 )
Junior Member
Wow ... Makes me want to do that to my DB 7... I guess im off to a good start with the PIC Coilovers... I wish I
had a shop or a garage like that to do my work... Guess ill just have to stick with the jack/jackstands and my
driveway
_ __ ___ __ ___ __ ___ __
94 Integra LS 4 Door ( Sold)
DB Squad Member # 231
09-04-2007 , 03 :37 PM
1200 Hobos
#13
Re: (94 IntegraLS)
Member
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09-06-2007 , 10 :16 AM
mullet eater
#14
Re: (theBRIANjonestownMASSACRE )
Junior Member
09-06-2007 , 11 :41 AM
bpr0422
#15
Re: Hiper Suspension Up ! ASR, PIC , SPC, NRG, ST, Mugen, Tanabe, Energy Suspension, & more (Guam_C
Member
09-07-2007 , 04 :58 PM
optoomistic
#16
Re: Hiper Suspension Up ! ASR, PIC , SPC, NRG, ST, Mugen, Tanabe, Energy Suspension, & more (Guam_C
09-07-2007 , 05 :37 PM
#17
Guam_CiviC619
Member
You guys can figure out retail. I researched all parts online for pricing and purchasing, utilizing vendors here , and
online vendors (JHPUSA, Summit Racing, etc). eBay was not used to purchase anything except for the junkyard
96-00 Civic knuckes. eBay was used as "leverage" to purchase some parts. I'll post labor and shops I used to
help me with pressing out stuff , as well as other miscellanious costs.
Front Lower Control Arm Bushings, 4 bushings : $90 (charged me an hour for labor)
Wheel Studs, Wheel Bearings, Lower Ball Joint : $150 (for both, dealer and other places wanted at least double)
Sand Blasting Both knuckles : $50
Shop Lift, 34 hours @ $5 an hour . $170
Mounting , Lifetime Balancing, Tire Disposal, Road Hazard Warranty: $163
4 -wheel Alignment: $70
Wheel Bearings x 2: $ 94
Lower Ball Joint x2 : $67
Steering Tie Rod Boot x2 : $23
Tie Rods x 2 : $58
Various OEM Hardware (suspension bolts, nuts, estimate): $100
Stainless Endlink Hardware and Galvanized Spacers : $45
Civic knuckles :$55
Subtotal : $1135
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09-07-2007 , 05 :40 PM
#18
Guam_CiviC619
Member
My poly squeaks and creeks like a mofo !! I don 't think there is any way around it. I used copious amounts of
high-pressure grease along with the teflon tape too. Poly = inherent squeaking.
EDIT : making use of error
09-08-2007 , 05 :50 PM
bpr0422
#19
Re: (Guam_ CiviC619 )
Member
I dunno, but whenever i see the ES bushing bearing I see a design flaw...
even if you add enough grease in the middle part, and add a grease zerk so you can put more grease in there till
it overflows out of the center....
i think the squeaking comes from the metal rubbing against the SIDES of the bushing...
or the SIDEs of the bushings lock onto the shock fork...and then twist inside the lca...
so i think that is why it squeaks..
cause the OEM rubber ones don 't sit on the outside of the LCA, or at least the fork attachment point doesn't...
so maybe if you put a washer that is the same size as the bearing inbetween the bearing and the shock fork.. to
create a space so that the for doesn't touch the sides of the bushing...
the squeaking could be reduced...
I don't have an ES kit, so i can't try it out...
EDIT : I added a quick gif
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09-19-2007 , 09 :26 PM
#20
Guam_CiviC619
Member
Good idea, but flawed. On many of the spaces where poly is used the "overflow" of poly increases the width
significantly so that nothing will fit in between it and the mounting point. ThanX though , your idea is appreciated.
Maybe someone will come up with a solution one of these days , for me it 's bearable and is only pronounced
where the suspension is forced to articulate at extreme angles , such as going over speed bumps and exiting/
entering driveway and the like.
Well it's time for a short term review. At this time I still have not installed the front anti-roll bar, and all
comments are based on the softest setting unless noted otherwise. My initial impressions still remain, and the DC
bar has been permanently removed and will be for sale soon.
1 st off, turn-in is razor sharp, steering input is highly accurate as well as steering response, although steering
feel is still numb or very light. I'd like to believe this is the inherent nature of the Civic's power steering . The
thought of eliminating it has crossed my mind many of times over the years and this seals the deal. While
making a turn, weight transfer in the rear seems to lag for a fraction of a second as if the rear is playing catchup with the front. This is the best way to describe it, as you would have to be an occupant or driver to know
exactly how that feels if you 've never felt it before. Although this does not hinder the driving experience and a
high sense of control still remains . This condition is hardly noticeable during rapid transitional response such as in
slalom type maneuvers. Body roll is greatly reduced, and cornering attitude remains relatively flat, all the while
handling balance remains very neutral, which is exactly what I was aiming for. I'm looking forward to trying the
Suspension Techniques front bar and ITR rear bar in tandem. During steady state cornering the tires grip
extremely well and their overall construction seems to positively contribute to the vehicles steering response, all
the while the PIC's do a good job of maintaining a contact patch over less-than -ideal tarmac. Overall the car is a
delight in the twisty stuff! Can 't wait for my 1 st auto-x session.
Ride quality is a love/hate relationship. With the new suspension the car feels much smoother than before, even
with the poly bushings all over the place. Although it's harsh on stretches of freeway that have a rippled road
surface , the rear can't help but have a, dare I say, bouncy feeling to it, this is really exaggerated when the rear
setting is bumped to 4. As said around HT before , rear spring rate will have a large effect on overall ride quality.
Just about anything else in the road, asphalt undulations and the like, does not feel overly dramatic. Large
freeway /highway dips are soaked up, as well as the occasional odd hump in the freeway /highway. The only thing
I fear are large pot holes (who doesn't fear those ?) and road transitions where the entire road surface makes a
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sudden shift straight up. These send a very unnerving jolt through the chassis and are met with a loud thud. I
feel this setup is an ideal balance for a daily driver and occasional track car. Ask a woman, she'll tell you it's
bouncy , ask me and I'll say it's stiff.
This = ouch !
10-06-2007 , 05 :38 PM
spAdam
#21
Re: (Guam_ CiviC619 )
Junior Member
P .S. I love that you're as particular about the details as I am. Prep is more important as the parts you put on.
_ __ ___ __ ___ __ ___ __
Nobody makes me bleed my own blood. Nobody!
Jdm coupe council, where coupes stick together:http ://www.jdmcoupecouncil.com...=1314
10-06-2007 , 08 :05 PM
TPB
#22
Re: (Guam_ CiviC619 )
Junior Member
If you didn't get an alignment immediately after you had all this work done, then I can guarantee that's your
problem .
10-06-2007 , 09 :18 PM
#23
gsrob
Junior Member
Killer suspension set up. Looks really good, nice new oem parts too.
_ __ ___ __ ___ __ ___ __
For Sale :
10-08-2007 , 07 :26 PM
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#24
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Hiper Suspension Up ! ASR, PIC , SPC, NRG, ST, Mugen, Tanabe, Energy Suspension, & more - Honda-Tech
hawjboi
Page 36
Re: Hiper Suspension Up ! ASR, PIC , SPC, NRG, ST, Mugen, Tanabe, Energy Suspension, & more (Guam_C
Junior Member
10-09-2007 , 02 :43 PM
Guam_CiviC619
#25
Re: (spAdam)
Member
Thanx for checking this out fellas. I was away in Vegas for the weekend for my buddies bachelor party and did
not have internet access.
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Chula Juana 619, CA,
You Es Of A
Posts : 1, 235
Quote:
Thanx , glad you noticed that I am particular. If I'm doing mechanical work that has related maintenance items, I
am most likely going to prepare to replace associated parts. The place I use for alignments does not use lasers,
they do it the old fashioned way, although use precision specialty tools:
Front camber -1 7/8 * (maxed)
Front toe 0*
Rear camber -1 15/16*
Rear toe +1 /16* (maxed)
I realize these are not aggressive settings and I am stuck with my front camber unless I slot the arm more. So let
this be a lesson to those interested in SPC front camber arms.
Quote:
Although it may appear to be so, I'd like to believe steering feel and steering response are two seperate handling
characteristics . My understanding is that steering response is the vehicles immeadiate behavior to steering input,
whereas steering feel is the feedback felt through the steering wheel itself. Yes, that was after my alignment.
Quote:
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3/15/2010 10:47:11 PM