Periphery's Use of The Keeley 4 Knob Compressor...

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01-10-2010, 02:27 PM
JoshuaLogan
#1
Periphery's use of the Keeley 4 knob compressor...
Banned
Okay, I'm curious about Periphery's use of the Keeley 4 knob compressor.
As far as I know, they are the ONLY band/artist I know of who uses a compressor before high gain amp settings... and in
particular the only metal band I know of who does this. I think the reason for this is because compressors add a lot of noise
when used with high gain settings. However, the noise gates counteract that, I guess...
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Now, I've used compressors before an amp (or amp sim) before for clean tones and I like what it does for cleans (I'm big
into the ambient Pink Floyd-esque type clean sounds for prog rock stuff), but never with high gain rhythm or lead tones. I
understand that they leave the compressor on at all times and use it to kind of fight with the noisegates to allow high
threshold settings for the quick start/stop riffing without killing sustain for slower more sustained notes (like a drawn out
chord, or a lead with a lot of feel, etc.).
I found this idea interesting because I was considering getting an ISP Decimator Pro Rack G which has a similar effect
(minus the compression, of course). So, I'm thinking about trying out the compressor + noise gates thing instead and
seeing how that works. I just have a few questions.
1. How exactly is the compressor setup in conjunction with the noise gates? I believe Misha uses two gates.... a decimator
and a boss ns-2. Is one of these in the FX loop to kill amp hum and the other for gating feedback? or are they both before
the amp? If so, how are they setup?
2. Can you easily find a balance between the compressor settings and noise gate threshold settings that keeps the
dynamics in check well enough to allow switching from a high gain channel to a clean channel without killing the sustain
for cleans? This is the reason why I'm interested in the ISP Pro Rack G.
3. What kind of effect does the compressor have when playing with high gain settings? I haven't tried yet, but I imagine it
would even out the signal a lot, which would probably make legato and tapping stuff seem easier than without the
compressor. Is this noticeable? does it hurt the high gain tone in any way? Say, maybe an undesirable "smoothing out" of
pick attack or anything like that?
I'll probably send Misha a PM asking him to look at this thread when he gets a chance, but if anybody else has some
experience with this and has info for me, let me know!
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01-10-2010, 02:59 PM
AlexWadeWC
SS.org Regular
#2
I bought a Keeley 4 Knob after I saw the Periphery gear video because I wanted to be able to set my single ISP noise gate
tighter, yet still have alot of sustain. I talked to Misha and he said he runs the comp first in his chain, before everything.
I have yet to even break out my set up and even try the comp which is a bummer, so I can't tell you the effect on the
overall tone, but when I do I'll let you know how it goes.
Right now I have my chain planned as follows:
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tuner -> 4 knob comp -> ISP -> digitech whammy -> OD-9
and from what I could see in the video his chain was ISP -> OD -> NS-2, with the comp before all of that.
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01-10-2010, 03:21 PM
JoshuaLogan
Banned
#3
Yeah, I'm kinda wondering why two gates are used before the amp like that. It seems like you could maybe get away with
just using one and placing it last, after the OD, but then maybe the extra noise would be too much... not sure...
21/10/2014 20:20
Periphery's use of the Keeley 4 knob compressor... - SevenString.org
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01-10-2010, 04:09 PM
Sepultorture
#4
tried the G string ISP decimator pedal at a friends place, DEFINITELY getting one
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01-10-2010, 04:10 PM
Fzau
Unleash the proggies
#5
I thought Misha's NS-2 was placed after the G-Major, so that it was silenced as well.. that what I remember from the vid at
least
Don't know whether the G-Major was in front of his amp or in the loop though
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01-10-2010, 05:02 PM
JoshuaLogan
Banned
#6
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fzau

I thought Misha's NS-2 was placed after the G-Major, so that it was silenced as well.. that what I remember from the vid at least
Don't know whether the G-Major was in front of his amp or in the loop though
The video didn't really explain it too well. It listed the gates and compressor, but not much more info about it.
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I've never heard of anyone else using a compressor like this, so that's why I'm so curious.
01-10-2010, 05:12 PM
MF_Kitten
Set up us the bomb
#7
im guessing the Decimator removes noise for a cleaner signal, while the NS-2 is used as a hard-ass gate. so you have the
compressor that makes the entire signal hit the distortion at once (kinda, sorta), while evening things out and giving lots
of sustain. the downside is that it brings up tons and tons of noise. the Decimator would be quieting the signal so the
signal/noise ration is more normal, maybe even quieter than normal (i havent tried it myself, so i dont know). then it
goes through the TS for tonal shaping and boosting, and then through the NS-2 that does the gating job harder and more
direct.
so thats my guess. compression-noise reduction (smoother)-boosting-hard gate.
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01-10-2010, 05:24 PM
Fzau
Unleash the proggies
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#8
VHT Valvulator => BOSS TU-2 => Keeley 4-knob compressor => ISP Decimator => Maxon OD808 => NS-2 => G-Major
=> TC Electronics Stereo/Chorus/Flanger
NVM what I stated earlier
Bulb also uses the compressor to fight against his two noise gates.
Without it I don't think he would be able to get a good low chunck out of the palm mutes for example since the gates would
catch on too quickly.
Plus he can still have an amazingly tight sound to if he palm mutes a but higher than normal (or any other PM technique
he uses).
That's the main reason methinks.. knowing how much of a tone nerd Misha is
The reason why I haven't heard of other bands who do this could be:
21/10/2014 20:20
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a) they do it but we just don't know it

b) they don't need/like the sound/ know about this way of altering your sound
Cool thing about the 4-knob Keeley compressor is that it offers more parameters to adjust than the traditional compressor,
thereby making it easier to sculpt your tone. I have one on my wishlist
Quote:
Originally Posted by MF_Kitten

im guessing the Decimator removes noise for a cleaner signal, while the NS-2 is used as a hard-ass gate. so you have the
compressor that makes the entire signal hit the distortion at once (kinda, sorta), while evening things out and giving lots of
sustain. the downside is that it brings up tons and tons of noise. the Decimator would be quieting the signal so the signal/noise
ration is more normal, maybe even quieter than normal (i havent tried it myself, so i dont know). then it goes through the TS
for tonal shaping and boosting, and then through the NS-2 that does the gating job harder and more direct.
so thats my guess. compression-noise reduction (smoother)-boosting-hard gate.
This too
No idea how the actual gate parameters are set though, that would be to taste I guess
Last edited by Fzau; 01-10-2010 at 05:28 PM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost
01-10-2010, 07:53 PM
#9
HighGain510
You guys realize Misha posts here right?
I'm sure it would be easier to just ask him directly how he uses what he
Cold As Ice
uses...
I know he's crazy busy recording but if you contact him directly I'm sure he'd get back to you eventually with
more than just speculation.
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01-10-2010, 08:05 PM
#10
Metalus
Quote:
JP BFR Whore
Originally Posted by HighGain510

I'm sure it would be easier to just ask him directly how he uses what he uses...
I know he's crazy busy recording but if you contact him directly I'm sure he'd get back to you eventually with more than just
speculation.
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+1
I would love more info on this too
. I have a keeley compressor on my wishlist as well
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01-10-2010, 08:23 PM
JoshuaLogan
Banned
#11
Quote:
Originally Posted by HighGain510

I'm sure it would be easier to just ask him directly how he uses what he uses...
I know he's crazy busy recording but if you contact him directly I'm sure he'd get back to you eventually with more than just
speculation.
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I didn't want to bother him since he's busy. I just left him a PM asking him to check this thread whenever he gets a
chance.
01-10-2010, 08:45 PM
-Nolly-
#12
Quote:
Originally Posted by JoshuaLogan
21/10/2014 20:20
4 di 8
1. How exactly is the compressor setup in conjunction with the noise gates? I believe Misha uses two gates.... a decimator and a
boss ns-2. Is one of these in the FX loop to kill amp hum and the other for gating feedback? or are they both before the amp? If
so, how are they setup?
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There's a gate after the compressor, and another after the tubescreamer. The first one works with the compressor to get
the "infinite sustain" sound, that still cuts off extremely sharply when muted. The second is mainly just cutting down noise
introduced by the tubescreamer.
Bear in mind he's using an Engl, which has yet another gate built-in that operates in the loop to cut out any hiss generated
by the amp.
Quote:
2. Can you easily find a balance between the compressor settings and noise gate threshold settings that keeps the dynamics in
check well enough to allow switching from a high gain channel to a clean channel without killing the sustain for cleans? This is the
reason why I'm interested in the ISP Pro Rack G.
Shouldn't be too difficult at all. The compressor makes evens that all out so it's fairly easy.
Quote:
3. What kind of effect does the compressor have when playing with high gain settings? I haven't tried yet, but I imagine it would
even out the signal a lot, which would probably make legato and tapping stuff seem easier than without the compressor. Is this
noticeable? does it hurt the high gain tone in any way? Say, maybe an undesirable "smoothing out" of pick attack or anything like
that?
Depends on the compressor. My experiences with the Keeley are that if anything, I'd say you get a stronger attack. When
you're running a high gain tone, the sound is already very compressed so you don't really notice it being any easier to
play, the most noticeable effect is the sustain.
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01-10-2010, 08:52 PM
PirateMetalTroy
#13
Wait, so he has THREE noise gates?!
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01-10-2010, 08:54 PM
-Nolly-
#14
Quote:
Originally Posted by PirateMetalTroy

Wait, so he has THREE noise gates?!
yup
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01-10-2010, 09:41 PM
JoshuaLogan
Banned
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#15
Quote:
Originally Posted by -NollyThere's a gate after the compressor, and another after the tubescreamer. The first one works with the compressor to get the
"infinite sustain" sound, that still cuts off extremely sharply when muted. The second is mainly just cutting down noise introduced
by the tubescreamer.
Bear in mind he's using an Engl, which has yet another gate built-in that operates in the loop to cut out any hiss generated by the
amp.
Shouldn't be too difficult at all. The compressor makes evens that all out so it's fairly easy.
Depends on the compressor. My experiences with the Keeley are that if anything, I'd say you get a stronger attack. When you're
running a high gain tone, the sound is already very compressed so you don't really notice it being any easier to play, the most
noticeable effect is the sustain.
Thanks for the info, Nolly. I'll have to check one out sometime. It seems like a pretty clever trick and would mean I
wouldn't need the Pro Rack G to allow switching to cleans without choking out sustain. I definitely liked the way it reacted
in the video they posted.... if he held a note, it sustained, if he muted, it killed it instantly.... that's how I wish amps
reacted always! haha
21/10/2014 20:20
5 di 8
I still need to try the axe-fx 4 cable method style... if I can get it setup without a ground loop problem, I'll try using its
compressor in the same way.
01-11-2010, 01:04 AM
bulb
#16
hehe nolly hit the nail on the head

yeah all pedals are in front of the amp
keep in mind guys, i kinda designed my rig to be as undynamic as possiboo but only because that works for me, so perhaps
2 gates and/or a compressor in front wouldnt benefit you guys for your personal applications.
but in my case the sound is either on or off, and when its on its full gain and when its off its completely silent.
the compressor allows me to get controlled sustain without my gates choking the sound prematurely
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www.soundcloud.com/iambulb
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01-11-2010, 01:37 AM
8string
Grande puta de gear!
#17
How is the compressor set? slow attack fast release?

This is interesting for those chug chug start stop songs i tend to play.
mmmmmh... djent pie

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01-11-2010, 03:45 AM
All_our_Bass
#18
I think running compressors before high gain sounds awesome.
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01-11-2010, 10:08 AM
Samer
Dybbuk
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100%
#19
Quote:
Originally Posted by bulb

hehe nolly hit the nail on the head
yeah all pedals are in front of the amp
keep in mind guys, i kinda designed my rig to be as undynamic as possiboo but only because that works for me, so perhaps 2
gates and/or a compressor in front wouldnt benefit you guys for your personal applications.
but in my case the sound is either on or off, and when its on its full gain and when its off its completely silent.
the compressor allows me to get controlled sustain without my gates choking the sound prematurely
Hey Misha,
your Gmajor + rack mount chorus are in front of the amp as well? Also why that specific compression pedal?
01-11-2010, 05:56 PM
bulb
#20
Quote:
Originally Posted by Samer

Hey Misha,
your Gmajor + rack mount chorus are in front of the amp as well? Also why that specific compression pedal?
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chorus is in front of the amp

gmajor is in the loop
that compressor was the only one of the many i tried that didnt mess with the tone, very transparent and the attack of the
effect was not overbearing, i got it for the clean channel, but then it ended up making the dirty channels sound better.
21/10/2014 20:20
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01-11-2010, 07:11 PM
cyril v
SS Contributor
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#21
Quote:
Originally Posted by bulb

chorus is in front of the amp
gmajor is in the loop
that compressor was the only one of the many i tried that didnt mess with the tone, very transparent and the attack of the effect
was not overbearing, i got it for the clean channel, but then it ended up making the dirty channels sound better.
^
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01-12-2010, 10:17 AM
right_to_rage
Avant Temporal
#22
Thats a pretty unique set up, except I wouldn't like having my signal on full boost all of the time which is what the gate
will allow. Like bulb says I don't know if the 'on/off' rig would work for me, but its good if you don't ever pull back on the
guitars volume knob to clean up a dirty sound. 3 noise gates lol, I dunno I'd have to hear it live, it would get rid of
accidental noise i bet but everything you play would be at the same volume! ahhh!!! no dynamics (beyond channel
switching). I couldn't live without my varying levels of pick attack
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01-12-2010, 10:34 AM
petereanima
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#23
Quote:
Originally Posted by right_to_rage

Thats a pretty unique set up, except I wouldn't like having my signal on full boost all of the time which is what the gate will allow.
Like bulb says I don't know if the 'on/off' rig would work for me, but its good if you don't ever pull back on the guitars volume
knob to clean up a dirty sound. 3 noise gates lol, I dunno I'd have to hear it live, it would get rid of accidental noise i bet but
everything you play would be at the same volume! ahhh!!! no dynamics (beyond channel switching). I couldn't live without my
varying levels of pick attack
you know, you could always buy a loop pedal/small "desktop"-loop, and put these pedals into it, leaving the pedals on the
whole time and jsut switch them in/out with the loop!
thats what i propably will do in the near future for my TS+ISP. i think i'll buy a midi-controlled little loop, so i can take
them out while switching to the Clean channel...
Djentsters will hate this!

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01-12-2010, 12:00 PM
bulb
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#24
Quote:
Originally Posted by right_to_rage

Thats a pretty unique set up, except I wouldn't like having my signal on full boost all of the time which is what the gate will allow.
Like bulb says I don't know if the 'on/off' rig would work for me, but its good if you don't ever pull back on the guitars volume
knob to clean up a dirty sound. 3 noise gates lol, I dunno I'd have to hear it live, it would get rid of accidental noise i bet but
everything you play would be at the same volume! ahhh!!! no dynamics (beyond channel switching). I couldn't live without my
varying levels of pick attack
well i definitely can get varying levels of pick attack, my rig is very responsive so it affects the character of my tone
greaty. What im talking about is volume when i say it has no dynamics, and the fact that i cant roll back my volume knob
to clean up my tone, which i dont ever do, so thats not much of an issue. But the rig feels awesome to play, because it is
incredibly responsive and feels great when you really dig in!

01-13-2010, 08:57 AM
#25
21/10/2014 20:20
7 di 8
biggness
s lelf
Quote:
Originally Posted by HAUCH

Just for shits, I tried putting a compressor/gate/od/gate in front of an amp on my axe fx. Not sure how to make this work, I'm
not sure how to employ the compressor correctly.
Very interesting, though.
Try this:
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Compressor
Type - pedal
Sust - 5.47
Att - 5.79
Rel - 5.67
Detect - Rms
Level - 3.5
Drive
Type - Tube Drive
Drive - 0
Tone - 4.88
Level - 10
Amp
Type - Das Metal
Drive - 4.88
Bass - 3.90
Mid - 5.00
Treb - 8.66 (bright on)
Pres - 1.57
Depth - 5.00
Master - 3.19
Graphic EQ
63 - 0
125 - neg4.1
250 - neg7.3
500 - neg5.0
1k - neg7.3
2k - neg7.3
4k - neg6.4
8k - +0.3
Gate
I'm using the gate on the 3rd tab of the layout page.
Thresh - 52.8
Ratio - 2.36
Release - 10ms
Attack 10ms
This should make you smile. haha Keep in mind that I am running the axe through an art sla2 poweramp, with cabs sims
off and poweramp sims on, through a Mesa 4x12 with v30's. Also this is with v9.0 firmware. All other parameters(the ones
not listed) are left to factory default. This should give you a pretty good starting point on how to run a comp for high gain
use. Well anyways, lemme know what you think of the patch.
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Periphery's use of the Keeley 4 knob compressor... - SevenString.org

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Originally Posted by Fzau

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Periphery's use of the Keeley 4 knob compressor... - SevenString.org

a) they do it but we just don't know it

Originally Posted by MF_Kitten

Last edited by Fzau; 01-10-2010 at 05:28 PM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost

You guys realize Misha posts here right?

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Originally Posted by HighGain510

Feedback Score: 5 reviews, 100%

I would love more info on this too

. I have a keeley compressor on my wishlist as well

Originally Posted by HighGain510

Join Date: Jan 2008

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Originally Posted by JoshuaLogan

Periphery's use of the Keeley 4 knob compressor... - SevenString.org

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Wait, so he has THREE noise gates?!

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Originally Posted by PirateMetalTroy

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Periphery's use of the Keeley 4 knob compressor... - SevenString.org

hehe nolly hit the nail on the head

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How is the compressor set? slow attack fast release?

mmmmmh... djent pie

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I think running compressors before high gain sounds awesome.

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Originally Posted by bulb

Originally Posted by Samer

chorus is in front of the amp

Periphery's use of the Keeley 4 knob compressor... - SevenString.org

Perceive beyond the seam.

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Originally Posted by bulb

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