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TrackProcurement 23/06
SteelgirdersVsPSCgirders
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16:38

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Posted:SatSep24,20119:38am
Thoughsteelgirdersarerequiredtobemaintainedperiodically,those
arefarbetterinviewofsafetywhencomparedwithPSCgirders.
Thosewhoarecreatingassetsarenotboundtomaintainthesamein
oursystem,likeOpenline&Construction.Qualityofworksdiffers
fromcontractorstocontractors,EngineerstoEngineers,Placeto
PlaceetceventhoughtheSpecifications,Codes,Manualstobe
followedaresame.
Themainadvantagesinsteelgirdersviz,problemslikecorrosioncan
beovercomewithprotectivecoating,possibilitiesofstrengthening
whereverorwheneverorwhateverrequired,easyreplacementby
steelgirdersifitwarrants,temporarygirdersofsimilarspans
availableincaseofemergenciesetc
ThespanofPSCgirdersmostlyarenotmatchingwiththe
conventionalsteelgirderspanof12.2,18.3,24.4,30.5etc.Ifany
PSCgirderfailsthealternatearrangementisnotconfinedbutwe
knowfailureinPSCwillbeasudden.

G.Radhakrishnan

SharedDocuments

InourZone,conceptofprovidingPSCgirdersinplaceofsteel
girdersduringGCis100%implementedresultingsteelgirderbridges
inMGhavebeenrebuiltwithPSCinBG.

Withinshortperiodoftime,wearefacingleachingproblemsinPSC
Joined:May11,2010 girders(wateriscomingfromthedeckslabtobottomofPSCsolid
girders)whichwillleadtocorrosionintendonsalsoandfailurein
No.of
nearfuture.
Replies:488
Duetononavailabilityofbridgestaff(Nointakeforaquitelong
period)SSE/Bridgesareengagingcontractsystemforinspection
also.(IhaveseensuchtendersinSWR)Noticingtheproblemsitself
nowbecomingaquestionmark
Atthisjuncture,whataretheprecautionstobetakenincaseof
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failureoremergenciesinPSCgirderbridges?
Also,whataretheremedialmeasuresbeingadoptedincaseof
suchleachingproblemsanywhere?

G.Radhakrishnan...240911

Posted:SatSep24,20116:01pm
Inthegoodoldendays,forhigherspans,steelgirderswerepre
dominantlyused.Aftertheadventofprestressedconcrete,itsusein
higherspanbridgesincreasedtremendously.Mainreasonbehinduse
ofPSCgirdersisduetoitsinitialeconomicalcost
Mainreasonsfornotpreferringsteelgirderbridgesare:
(i)Itsinitialcostismore.(ii)Itrequiresrecurringexpenditurein
painting.
IncontrarytothatitisbelievedthatPSCgirdersarecheaperand
doesnotrequireanytypeofmaintenance.
OnemoremeritofPSCGirderBridgeisaboutitsfacilityof
providingthesametrackstructurelikeinapproaches.
Demerits:
AsfarasdemeritsofthePSCgirdersareconcerned,theseare
(i)Brittlefailurenature.(ii)Lesslife.(iii)Verydifficult
strengthening/repair/restoration
Concreteisbrittleinfailure.Itfailsallofasuddenwithoutgiving
anywarning.FailureofMondoviBridgeatGoaisaburning
example.
Contrarytothis,steelgirderswhichareductileinnaturegivesample
warnings
beforefailure
Sinceconcreteisverystrongincompression,PSCconstructionhas
gainedmomentum.
ButunlikeRCC,PSCrequireslotofqualitycontrol.Highdurability
NarasimhaMurty
hastobemaintainedduringconstruction.Thegirdershouldbe
Gannavarapu
impervious.otherwisewaterwillpercolateintothemember.Since
Dy.General
Manager(civil)/RVNL thecablesareheavilystressedtheywillpronetocorrosionatafaster
rateduetoingressedwater.
SriRadhakrishnanhasquotedthatthegirdersareleakingheavily
SharedDocuments
indicatesthepoorqualityinconstructionwhichwillspoilthegirders
withinshortperiod.
Joined:May14,2007 Remedies:(i)Observingthecamberatregularintervalsinorderto
No.of
knowthesoundnessofthegirder.
Replies:838
(ii)Ifsubstantialdecreaseincamberisnoticed,externalprestressing
istoberesortedthroughfuturecablels.
(iii)Ifanylossofprestressistakenplace,itcanbenoticednearend
blocksintheformofshearcracksat45angle.Henceendblocks
havetobeobservedcperiodically.
RailwayBoardvidetheirletterNo.2005/CE1/BR11/8dtd
28.05.2009hasinstructedtoadoptsteelgirdersforspansmorethan
24.40m.
ThereasonsasmentionedintheBoard,sletterare(1)Thereareno
detailedguidelinesforinspectionanddefectsidentificationofPSC
girders(ii)Incaseofanyeventualityonsuchbridges,Rly.donothave
anyimmediatetemporaryrestorationmeasuresavailbleupto80
ft.temporaryspanarrangements.(iii)Atthesametimesteelbridges
areknowntohavelongerlifethanothersandIRhavemanynumber
ofexamples.

NarasimhaMurtyGannavarapuEXECUTIVEENGINEER(CON)...240911

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Posted:MonSep26,20118:50am
Regrettedtohighlightthatwithoutdevelopingsuitableguidelinesfor
inspection&maintenance,wehaveswitchedovertoPSCgirders!
andmostofthesteelgirderbridgeshavebeenconvertedintoPSC.
GeneralcommentduringinspectionisWhatistheretoseeinPSC
whencomparedwithsteelwithoutconsideringtheconsequences!!
G.Radhakrishnan

RecentlyconstructedPSCgirderbridgesduringGChavestarted
givingsymptomsabouttheirhealth.Nextgenerationwillhavetoface
alotofproblemswithpoorqualityPSCgirders.Atthattime,anew
SharedDocuments technologymaybeimplementedinlieuofPSCandlikeourearly
steelgirdersallPSCgirdersconstructedbeforexxxxxshallbe
Joined:May11,2010 replaced!!!

No.of

Replies:488

G.Radhakrishnan...260911

Posted:TueSep27,201112:19pm

RAMKUMAR
SINGH
DyCVO
(Engg)/SECR

Railwayhasrealisedtheproblemsoonandhasagainshiftedtosteel
girdersforspanmorethan24.4m.

RAMKUMARSINGHDy.CE/BR/Splworks/SECR/BSP...270911

SharedDocuments
Joined:
No.of
Replies:20
Posted:WedSep28,20115:53am
Good.
InthemeantimeanumbersofPSCgirdershavebeenerectedwith
spansmorethan24.4m
Specificguidelinesarerequiredtobeframedandcirculatedfor
inspection,maintenance,monitoringthenoticeddefects,methodof
recordingcamber,temporaryarrangements,actionincaseof
SharedDocuments emergenciesincludinglossofcamber,methodofreplacementincase
offailureintheexistingPSCgirders

Joined:May11,2010
No.of

Replies:488
G.Radhakrishnan...280911
G.Radhakrishnan

Posted:FriSep30,201112:38pm

NarasimhaMurty

Anarticleon"INSTRUMENTATIONTECHNIQUESTO
MONITOR
LOSSOFPRESTRESSANDCORROSIONOFSTEEL
INPRESTRESSEDCONCRETE"canbeseeninthislinkwhichis
usefulforbridgemaintenancewing:

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Gannavarapu
Dy.General
http://www.rdso.indianrailways.gov.in/uploads/files/1296817034676
Manager(civil)/RVNL bs_36.pdf

SharedDocuments

Joined:May14,2007
No.of
Replies:838

NarasimhaMurtyGannavarapuEXECUTIVEENGINEER(CON)...300911

Posted:SatOct01,20113:09pm
FromtheabovequotedArticle,thefollowingsentencesare
reproducedhere.
Concretestructuresaresupposedtogivetroublefreeand
maintenancefreeservice,ifconstructedproperly.Normally,
durabilityaspectsareusuallylostsightof.Becauseofwhich,many
times,concretestructuresdevelopdefectsduringtheirservice.
Itwillbeworthwhiletonotethatnodirectmethodisavailableto
measurelossofprestress.
ItcanbenotedthatV.W.loadcellsystemissuitablefornew
constructionandnotforexistingbridge.
VibratingWireStrainGaugeissuitableforuseonnewaswellas
existingbridges.Notmuchofliteratureonactualuseofabove
instrumentationsystemisavailableeitherinIndiaorabroad
Noinstrument/techniqueisavailable,atpresent,whichcan
measuretheextentofcorrosionofsteel
G.Radhakrishnan

SharedDocuments

Itwillnotbeincorrecttostatethattheinstrumentationof
bridgesisstillataprimitivestageinIndia.

Joined:May11,2010 Hence,wecannotgoforinstrumentationofeachbridgeduetocost
No.of
affair,SERCorothersimilarorganizationtobeinvitedandalso
Replies:488
instrumentationalonewillnotsolveourproblems.Wemayhaveto
goforrehabilitation,strengtheningorreplacementafter
instrumentation.
Duetoleachingdefect,thereinforcementsincludingtendonswill
corrodewithaperiodoftimewhichwillleadtolossofprestress.No
instrumentationisfurtherrequiredforcorrosionorlossofprestress.
Whatwillbetheremedialaction,oncecorrosionstarted?
Insteelgirders,themainproblemiscorrosionwhichcanbe
controlled.Even,camberlossgirdersarestillsurvivinginother
topicsofthisforum.

G.Radhakrishnan...011011

Posted:SunOct02,20119:16am
Therearefewthingstobeconsidered:
1.ThePSCgirdersarenotasfragileastheyarenormallypresumed
tobe.Thesearedesignedasductilestructuresasthenormal
steel/RCCstructuresareandthecrackswillbethereinstructurefor
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longtimebeforeactualcollapsetakesplace,exceptinthecasewhen
thePSCtendonsarenotgroutedproperlyandsnapduetocorrosion.
2.Yes,theunderstandingofPSCgirdersisonlowersidetodesired,
partlybecauseoflackoftrainingandpartlybecauseoflackof
difficultnatureofsubject.Butitcannotbesaidthatthesewere
introducedwithoutpreparationsasthewillhavetheproblemof
chickenandeggsituationwhethertofirstconstructPSC,whichisa
materialofchoiceworldover,orfirstcreateawarenessand
inspectionmethodology.IwouldsaythattheapproachwasOKthat
wayandiftheorganizationcannotgetpeopletolearnthethingsin30
years,thereisnoexcuseaboutanything.

V.B.Sood
Director(B&S)
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Joined:
No.of
Replies:1674

3.Ourbridgemanagementisnotinthatgreatshape.Exceptforthe
steelgirderinspectionandmanagement,whichtomeistheeasiestto
learnandmaster,wearelackinginalmostallaspects.Thefloodsand
scourisaverymuchneglectedfield,substructureinspectionisa
joke,underwaterinspectionshaveassumedsomesortofpriorityonly
afterkillingscoresofpeopleonthisaccount.Andthelesssaidabout
modernfieldslikeNDT,thebetteritis.Ihadanopportunityto
inspectsomeoldarchesandIsawoldinspectionrecordsfor25years
orsoandwasastonishedtoseethedivergingviewsthatlearned
engineershavetakenovertheyearsandalmostnonehadgivena
solutionthatcouldrestorethebridgestoarespectableshape.This
muchfortheoldesttypeofthebridgesthatweareusing.So,the
issueofPSCisnotthatdirewhenseeninlightwithitsolderpeers.
4.Theproblemintheparticularcaseappearsduetotheslab
connectingtheIgirders.Theseslabsarethelastitemofconstruction
andthetimeconstraintscancausetheproblemsmentioned.Butthe
problemwillmostlikelybeinRCCandnotPSCcomponents.Ifthis
isthecase,youcancheerupasRCCisloteasiertomaintainand
rehabilitatethanPSC,andalsothewatermightnotbeaffectingthe
tendons.WehaddealtwithsomesuchcasesonWRandIhadmadea
filmonthesamewhichcanbeseenhere:
http://wiki.iricen.gov.in/doku/doku.php?id=training_films
Iftheproblemisdifferent,pleaseletusknow.

V.B.SoodDirector(B&S)...021011

Posted:WedOct05,201112:18pm

G.Radhakrishnan

SharedDocuments
Joined:May11,2010
No.of
Replies:488

Inmycaseisdifferent.PSCsolidgirdersof10spansof9.14meach
inabridgeconstructedduringtheyear1998,arehavingleaching
defect(fromthetopofdecktobottom)inalmostallthegirders.
Seepageofwater,afterraining,canbevisuallyseen.Also,atthe
junctionofretainingwallconnectingdeckslabinsomanybridges
includingROBssuchleachingdefectswerenoticed

G.Radhakrishnan...051011

Posted:WedOct12,20117:33am
InPSCboxgirders,theopenspacesaremisusedbypublic.Ifound
thatonePSCboxgirderROBisusedasminiBAR.Shallweclose
theopeningsprovidedintheboxgirders.
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Onseeingsuchmischievouswegetwarningas"dangerahead!"

G.Radhakrishnan...121011

G.Radhakrishnan

SharedDocuments
Joined:May11,2010
No.of
Replies:488
Posted:WedOct19,20111:52pm
Therearemanyfactorsthatgointodecidingthematerialtobeused
inconstruction.Firstandforemostoftheseistherealityandfactsas
theyexist,insteadofwhatwethinktheyshouldbeorassumethemto
be.Ourassumptionsmustasclosetorealityaspossible.

A.P.MALIK
CPM1
SharedDocuments
Joined:
No.of
Replies:118

Andthefactis,PSCisnotthematerialforourbridges.Ourquality
control,handlingequipments,maintenanceresourcesarenotfitfor
PSCgirders.Forspansof9.15mandabove,weshouldsticktosteel
girders,thetried,thetestedandtheelegantelements.Forsleepers
overthemwemayapproachSCtoallowtimbers,asvolumewould
bemuchlessnow,asforeverythingelsewehaveswitchedoverto
PSCsleepers.
Unlikeroad,wecannotdiverttrafficatwill.Wegetverylimited
timeforrepairsandreplacement.Anyfailures,unlikeinaroad
bridge,arepotentialdisasterforus.Oursitesarewhereitisvery
difficulttotakecranestohandletheweightsinvolved.Justtogive
youanidea,totalweighttobehandledincaseofPSC9.15mspanis
82tonnes(minimumcomponentweightbeing20/30T,dependingon
whetherpreorposttensioned)asgainstabout9tonnesfora9.15m
steelspan.

A.P.MALIKDyCPM/C/III...191011

Posted:TueOct25,20113:14pm

AvijitMujumder

SharedDocuments

Apartfromabovedefficiencies,theheightofdeckincaseofPSC
girderisanotherdetrimentalfactorwhichcannotbeignoredasthe
approachofbridgesistoberaised.Incaseoftallpiers,seismicloads
onheaviersuperstructure(PSCgirders)hasconsiderableeffecton
substructure&it'sfoundation.

AvijitMujumder...251011

Joined:Dec21,2009
No.of
Replies:15
Posted:MonNov21,20117:23am
ThetwomeritsmentionedbyEXECUTIVEENGINEER/CONfor
theuseofPSCgirdersalsohavingthefollowingdisadvantages
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(i)TheMainreasonbehinduseofPSCgirdersisduetoitsinitial
economicalcostisapplicablefornewconstructiononly.Inopen
line,replacementofsteelgirderwithPSCgirderwillcostmoredue
toexpensivelaunchingscheme,prolongedspeedrestriction&mega
lineblock
G.Radhakrishnan

(ii)OnemoremeritofPSCGirderBridgeisaboutitsfacilityof
providingthesametrackstructurelikeinapproaches.But,without
adheringthemanualprovisions,thesametrackstructureofapproach
SharedDocuments (LWR)hasbeencontinuedonthePSCgirderbridges.Ifanything
happensthenonlyresponsibilitywillbefixedandalsocircularswill
Joined:May11,2010 come.So,PSCgirderfacilitatesformisleadingtheLWRmanual
provisions
No.of

Replies:488

G.Radhakrishnan...211111

Posted:MonNov21,20114:52pm
Mr.Radhakrishnanhasexpressedviewinthemaintenancepointof
view.
Apartfromcertaindisadvantages,PSCgirdershavenumerous
advantagesalsoundoubtedly.
Sincesteelgirdershadlonghistoryandstoodforthetestoftimeand
moreoverthesteelismanufacturedatsteelplantswithhighest
qualitycontrol,nodoubttheyaresuperiorandstrongertoPSC
girders.Butthedisadvantagewiththemisthemaintainabilityoftrack
overthosegirders.LastdecadePWayEngineerssufferedalotonthat
score.ThenonlyPSCgirdershavecomeintopicture.
RegardingreplacementofsteelgirderswithPSC,itisrestrictedupto
6.10monlyandoverandabovetheywillbecastinsituonly.
AsfarascontinuingofLWRoverPSCgirderbridgesareconcerned,
certainRailwayshaveofficiallyundertakenthesameontrialbasis
andaregivingbetterresults.OffcourseKonkanRailwayhasalready
continuedtheirallLWRsongirderbridgesprovidedwithbearings
andnoanyuntowardincidentshavebeennoticed.
Manualsaresuggestiveonlyanddoesnotrestrictthe
betterments.Duetothisflexibility,correctionslipsarebeingissuedas
NarasimhaMurty
andwhenneeded.
Gannavarapu
Afterallwethescientificandengineeringcommunityshouldalways
Dy.General
Manager(civil)/RVNL thinkforbetterchangesandaccordinglyexperimentshavetobe
continued.
Gapsbetweensinglerailshavebeenprovidedforseveralyearswitha
SharedDocuments
viewthatlinearexpansionwillcreateproblemsuntilLWRshave
beendiscoveredandproveditwaswrong.
Joined:May14,2007 Rutherfordsquantumtheoryregardingelectronsrevolvingroundthe
No.of
nucleuswasprovedwrongtillBohrsexperimentrevealedthatthey
Replies:838
willrevolveinfixedorbitsafter60years.Thatissscienceand
changeswillalwaystakesplace.
AsfarasPSCgirdersareconcerned,themainproblemwiththemis
withthequalityatsite.Theyrequirehighstandards.Veryfew
contractorsawareofthesameandtheythoughtthatqualityisthe
responsibilityoftherailway.
Unlikesteel,concreteisaheterogeneousmixandhastobemadeat
site,maintainingqualityandachievinguniformqualityisatoughest
taskfortheConstn.Engineers.Knowingallthesefacts,Railway
Boardhasrestricteditsuseupto24.40mgirders.

NarasimhaMurtyGannavarapuEXECUTIVEENGINEER(CON)...211111

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Posted:MonNov21,201110:58pm
Ihavefocusedinmaintenancepointofviewonly.
InPambanBridge,wehavereplacedthePSC(MG)girderswithsteel
girdersbygantrymethod.
Steelgirderspansabove6.10marebeingconvertedintoPSCby
adoptingsuitablelaunchingschemeintrafficcondition.
PSCgirdersitselfmayrequirereplacement!

G.Radhakrishnan

Betterchanges(inthematerialofconstruction)arealwayswelcome.
Atthesametime,technologyformaintainingthesamealsotobe
developeddulyconsideringthevulnerablefactorssuchasqualityof
construction,environmentalcondition,workmanshipetc.,

SharedDocuments

Betterunderstandingisessentiallyrequiredwhenwechangeovertoa
newsystem

Joined:May11,2010 Asmentionedthatveryfewcontractorsaretakingcareofquality,
veryfewEngineersareworriedaboutqualityandhenceveryfew
No.of
bridgesareingoodcondition
Replies:488
Concretestepsarerequiredtobetakentosafeguardourassetsof
concretebridges
Steelgirders>>>Concretegirders>>>Compositegirders>>>?

G.Radhakrishnan...211111

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