Essence of Combat Science -- Wang Xiang Zhai

An Interview with Mr. Wang Xiangzhai about the Essence of Combat Science

The founding master of Dachengquan, Wang Xiang Yhai, who is famous in the North and South, and praised by the martial arts circles of the whole country, has recently mo ed to !ei"ing# $or the e%change of &nowledge and opinions among the practitioners of different martial arts, he has arranged a meeting time e ery Sunday afternoon from '()) pm to *()) pm, at Dayangyibin +lley, where he acts as the host, and e%changes opinions with other famous e%perts of bo%ing, carrying forward and promoting the martial spirit of our nation as his sincere wish# + reporter inter iewed ,r# Wang yesterday, ha ing the following discussion with him# -'. /nter iewer( / ha e always admired and respected your superb bo%ing s&ills, may / as& what is your aspiration with regard to the combat science0 Wang Xiang1hai( !eing praised as the representati e of Dachengquan2 by my friends really ma&es me embarrassed# / left my teacher in the 33rd year of the 4eign of 5uang Xu of the 6ing Dynasty 7'8)9:, and since then, / ha e tra elled all around the country, and thus / ha e seen much and learned much about life, left my footprints on uncountable places, both north and south of the Yangt1e 4i er, met many famous masters and eteran bo%ers, and e%perienced untold hardships# ,y biggest gain during these more than thirty years has been meeting many good teachers and helpful friends to compare s&ills and &nowledge with, thus / am confident that /, as a eteran bo%er, am on the right path of combat science# + few days ago, ,r# ;hang Yuheng repeatedly made some comments in newspapers# $earing that people of different circles ha e not clearly understood his meaning, and thus ha e had some misunderstandings, / wholeheartedly want to let people &now what / ha e in mind# ,y remaining years are

gradually waning away, life itself is enough, there is no room for fame and gain to occupy my mind, thus / am so an%ious to, while this body of mine has not yet decayed, "oin forces with prominent compatriots to ad ocate the full de elopment of natural instincts and martial irtue, and get rid of heresies# / do not want to be praised in ain, li&e those decei ing the public in order to gain fame# -<. /nter iewer( What is the basis of combat science0 Wang Xiang1hai( What is, after all, the basic principle of combat science0 Different people ha e different answers to this question, but studying bo%ing routines, forms of mo ements, fi%ed techniques, and training hits and beats, all fall into the category of superficial, and although the bo%ing routines and forms of mo ements ha e been popular already for a long time, they are, indeed, e%tremely harmful to the people# -3. /nter iewer( Xingyi2, Tai"i2, !agua2, and Tongbei2 are considered to be schools of internal bo%ing, what are the differences of all these branches0 Wang Xiang1hai( =eople often say that Xingyi2, Tai"i2, !agua2 and Tongbei2 are internal styles, / do not &now how the names of internal and e%ternal came about, so / cannot comment on that# !y obser ing the past famous masters, one can see a part of it though# The original Xingyi2, and the Xinyiba2 and >iuhebu2 of ?enan pro ince, are of the same school# When tracing the lineage of ,r# >i Daidong 7who was &nown as @ld Dai: of ?enan , you can find out that he is ,r# >i ;hiheAs greatBgrandson, ,r# >i ;hihe was the teacher of the old gentleman Dai >ongbang# The Yuan family of Ciyuan in fact followed the school of ,r# >i , although they named the art differently# ,r# Dai, although he changed the name Xinyi2 into Xingyi2, was not in contrary with the original meaning, and in that bo%ing the word bo%ing2 carried the meaning of most faithfully adhering to it# @ne should &now that the original Xingyi2 completely lac&ed the training method of the twel e forms, but the whole body was meant to e%press the essence of all these twel e forms# /t did not ha e the theory of the mutual promotion and restraint of the fi e elements, there were "ust the fi e elements representing fi e &inds of forces# /t did not ha e any fi%ed techniques, bo%ing routines or forms of mo ements either# / remember well the words of my late teacher about the fi e elements( ,etal means the strength contained in the bones and the muscles, the mind being firm li&e iron or stone, being able to cut gold and steel# Wood has the meaning of the bending but rooted posture of a tree# Water means force li&e the wa es of the ast sea, li ely li&e a dragon or a sna&e, when used, it is able to per ade e erything# $ire means strength being li&e gunpowder, fists being li&e bullets shot out, ha ing the strength to burn the opponent2s body by the first touch# Darth means e%erting strength hea y, deep, solid, and perfectly round, the qi being strong, ha ing the force of oneness with hea en and earth# This is the syncretism of the fi e elements# /t has nothing to do with one technique o ercoming another technique as the modern people claim# /f one first sees with the eyes, then thin&s of it again in the mind, and then launches the counterBattac& towards the enemy, it is ery seldom that one will not get beaten up# !agua2 was originally &nown as Ehuan1hang2# /n my childhood / met ,r# Eheng Tinghua, / remember he seemed to be li&e a di ine dragon roaming in the s&y, changing infinitely, it is hardly possible for the modern person to reach such s&ill and strength# / distantly remember

,r# Dong ?aichuan, it is e en harder to understand how profound was his insight into the Sea of >aw and attainment of the Tao# ,r# >iu $engchun is a friend of mine, his s&ills are really profound, but his attainments are slightly inferior, but still those studying the si%tyB four palms and se entyBtwo steps cannot compare with him# / wish that the people practising !agua2 would concentrate on the double and single chuan1hang2, paying special attention to intuiti ely percei ing e ery mo ement, doing their best to ta&e a more ad anced course of training, and earnestly enter into the theory, putting it all into practise for a long time, then they could get close to approaching its essence# +s masters of the original Tai"iquan2, / should recommend the Yang brothers Shaohou and Ehengfu# They are also old friends of mine, thus / &now that this bo%ing really has some &nowledge of mechanics, but out of one hundred persons not e en one gains its essence, and e en if one can gain it, it is still oneBsided, because the basic s&ills of intuiti e perception already died out a long time ago, thus their lower bodies ha e no real strength to spea& of# @riginally this bo%ing consisted of three fists, also called the Fold three cutsF, ,r# Wang ;ongyue changed it into thirteen posturesF, and it was later changed into as much as one hundred and forty or fifty postures, this is the ma"or reason for the distortion# $or health preser ation, it restrains the spirit and mettle, and brings discomfort to the practitioner# $or combat, it harms the practitioner2s limbs and trun&, and causes the useful body to become a mechanical and stiff thing, it also disturbs the student2s ner es, and is nothing more than wasting one2s time# +s for its method of training, a punch with a fist here, a slap with the palm there, a &ic& to the left, and another one to the right, that is pitiful and laughable# +s for dealing with an enemy in a fight, against a masterBhand, please do not e en consider it, if the ad ersary is not stiff and sluggish, e en the famous masters of this bo%ing ha e no chance to apply their s&ills# These abuses are so big that Tai"iquan2 might soon become "ust a mere form comparable to a chess manual# $or the last twenty years, most people who ha e studied this bo%ing ha e not been able to differentiate right and wrong, e en if someone has been able to differentiate them, he has not been capable of putting it into practice# +s for common students, most of them use their ears instead of their eyes# So ruined is this bo%ing that it has become useless, this is really deplorable# / wish that the powerful members of this school would promptly and strictly clean it up, and attempt to de elop it in the future# When the day of success comes, they will be held as the bosom friends of all the bo%ing fans# / dare to say that / understand Tai"iquan2 deeply, those who do not agree, can notify me or lay the blame on me, only the wise ones might understand# +t the same time, / suppose those who ha e really gained something in their study of Tai"iquan2, when they read this, they will nod in agreement and cannot help laughing# Tongbeiquan2 is popular in northern Ehina , especially in !ei"ing # The practitioners / ha e met were mostly out of shape, howe er, some were also holding a theory that was close to being right, but when chec&ing their s&ills, they were ery far from it# ,ost probably their predecessors were not li&e that, but the later generations ha e lost the essence# +lthough occasionally there were some who had deep and great s&ills in some oneBsided parts of it, e entually they will ha e no hope of wal&ing down the right path of combat science# ,eihuaquan2, which is also &nown as Wushi1huang2, has a direct lineage that has been passed down generation by generation, especially in ?enan and Sichuan pro inces# Their way is different in approach but equally satisfactory in results with that of the practitioners of Wu"isanshou2 of $u1hou , Xinghua, 6uan1hou, Shantou , and other places# They also ha e their special and profound strong points for dealing with the enemy, but unfortunately most of them are oneBsided and only ery few are complete# !afan2, ,ian1hang2, =igua2, !a"i2, Dagongli2, Sanhuangpao2, Niantui2, and >ianquan2, all ha e their strong and wea& points, most are oneBsidedly inclined to hardness and a few to softness, they lac& the internal s&ill of gathering the spirit# +s for Dahongquan2,

Xiaohongquan2, Tantui2, Ehuo"iao2, long bo%ing, short bo%ing, and the other arious schools, / would rather not discuss them# -G. /nter iewer( What is your opinion on preser ing the national arts0 Wang Xiang1hai( The bo%ing arts of our nation are in a chaotic state, thus the people cannot &now what course to ta&e# Summed up, they ha e abandoned the quintessence and &ept only the scum, nothing more# +lthough the martial arts of Capan and the bo%ing of Western Durope are oneBsided, they all ha e their original points# /n comparison to an ordinary bo%er of our nation, they are countless miles ahead# The people should be ery ashamed of this# So we should clean up and carry forward the old &nowledge# D%cept for us, who else is there left to do it0 Despite my meagreness, / call for action to ad ocate it, only for this purpose# -H. /nter iewer( Sir, you ha e fi%ed a time to play host to the martial artists of arious circles, this has pro ed that you are ery modest and enthusiastic for the martial way, but why do you do all this0 Wang Xiang1hai( The way of learning builds up from comparison, this applies to bo%ing as well# When comparing s&ills, there is ictory or defeat, but one2s personality is not harmed by it, on the contrary, it may impro e one2s personality and increase one2s morals# /f e eryone could inspect and learn from each other2s e%periences, the dispute between different schools could be a oided, and furthermore, it could stop the irresponsible tal&ing# / wish that those who pursue the same things as /, will not ta&e these words as empty tal&, and if the prominent personage and the wise hermits of this country will be willing to ma&e a "ourney to grant me instruction, they are ery welcome# /f you do not wish to come to isit me, please "ust send me a note and / will surely and wholeheartedly pay you a isit and respectfully listen to all you ha e to say# To sum up, / only see& to impro e the bo%ing art, / do not bother about anything else# -*. /nter iewer( Sir, you are the founding master of Dachengquan2, you must ha e some "udicious iews about this school, would you please tell us some details about it# Wang Xiang1hai( The way of combat science is e%tremely complicated and difficult to unra el# D%tremely complicated and difficult, yet it is e%tremely simple when its gist has been grasped# Thus when we study bo%ing, we should first &now what we study it for# When we &now that, we can surely gain something# ,ost people study bo%ing mainly for health, and then secondly for selfdefence# 5ood health is the basis of all the human acti ities, so the ways of health preser ation and protecting one2s body really cannot be neglected# /f one learns the method of e%ercise properly, then the benefits will be great, but learning it improperly can e en lead to death# @nly ery few of the sportsmen doing strenuous e%ercise can en"oy longe ity# The bo%ers who ha e lost their li es or in"ured their bodies because of improper e%ercise are uncountable# That &ind of bo%ing is indeed pitiful and also laughable# Inowing the ad antages and disad antages of studying bo%ing, one should e%perience and obser e the states of mo ement and stillness with special care while e%ercising, not only the e%ternal mo ement of the body, but also the mo ing state of the spirit# @ne should use the spirit and mind to obser e the whole body inside and outside, and whether e ery action is in accord with the requirements of health preser ation and selfB defence or not# Why mo e0 Why be still0 What are the results0 What is the phenomenon in

the middle of the process0 Thus percei e by intuition, and you will be approaching the truthJ +s for the profound and subtle essence of the Tao, one can only &eep on studying and searching, otherwise it is not easily gained# Now here is a brief summation of the beBall and endBall of Dachengquan2 to be questioned by the arious fellow martial artists, so that an open discussion on combat science can be started# $irst / shall tal& about the stages in the stude of bo%ing# +s / said before, health preser ation and selfBdefence are inseparable from each other, if one is lost, then abuses are created and one will enter the wrong path# $irst of all, one should train and foster the spirit, the temperament, and the natural instincts, and only after that start tal&ing about bringing the fine instincti e strength of the ner es, the limbs, and the trun& into play# The first step in studying bo%ing is e%ercising the ner es as the basic training method, and intuiti ely percei ing the peristalsis of the whole body# The second step is training the trial of strength 7shili: and the trial of oice 7shisheng:# The third step is selfBdefence# They are separately narrated below( !asic training( in daily life, in order to gain results from training all the time, while wal&ing, standing, sitting, and reclining, one must start the training from the pile standing 71han1huang: method# +rrange the posture of the whole body properly, &eep the body upright, ha e no thoughts, strengthen the ner es in stillness, ad"ust the breath, warm up and nourish the muscles, let e ery cell acti ate naturally# The strength comes from the inside and reaches the outside smoothly in the whole body# Thus, one does not train the bones and the muscles, yet they get trained by themsel es, one does not nourish the ner es but they get nourished by themsel es, one should especially e%perience and obser e their barely perceptible mo ement and acti ity# When one has done it for long enough time, one will &now that standing brings many ine%haustible wonders# @ne who wants to achie e wonders in his bo%ing s&ills, should first dedicate his time to pile standing# Trial of strength and trial of oice( after ha ing the basic training in bo%ing, one2s natural instincts ha e been strengthened# /n applying them one must ta&e strict precautions against the predominance of human desire, or else the misapplication of the illusory will arise# Sometimes, because of the predominance of desire, the natural instincti e strength becomes something that has nothing to do with e%ercising the natural instincts# Therefore the scholars of the past told us not to try helping the shoots grow faster by pulling them up# The way of applying the natural instincts can be suited to personal needs, but first, one must understand the mo ing state of strength, only then can one continue to the second phase# Trial of strength is the most important thing in learning the basis of bo%ing s&ills, with trial of strength one gains strength# The strength is gained and realised by trying it, and one will realise how to use the strength too# $irst one must ma&e the strength equal all o er the body, the muscles agile, and the bones supporting the frame of the body, so that the muscles can contract, stretch, rela%, and tense in harmony# Strength should come from inside and be issued outside# /n mo ement, slow e%cels o er quic&, be rela%ed rather than impatient, the mo ement should be slight and the spirit full# When one wants to mo e one will stop, when one wants to stop one will mo e, furthermore, when mo ing one cannot help but stop, when stopped, one cannot help but mo e# /n trial of strength, one should not ha e unilateral strength, furthermore, one should not ha e sheer strength# $irst of all, one should percei e by intuition whether the strength of the whole body is allBper ading or not, whether the strength can be issued out at any moment or not, and whether one can react to the atmosphere or not, furthermore, one must not let the mind brea& and the spirit disperse# ?a e light and hea y forces ready to be issued out, when one part of the body mo es, the whole body mo es# The strength is consistent,

resulting in nimble and hea y insubstantiality, and round and whole substantiality# Kp and down, left and right, front and bac&, do not forget them# To sum up, what cannot lead to comfort, happiness, and gaining strength does not deser e to be called bo%ing# The trial of oice is a supplement for the insufficiencies of trial of strength# +ll people ha e physiological differences due to the congenital, so e eryone2s body has parts difficult to connect, thus trial of oice is namely complementary internal breath wor&# /t is also called inner breath, or brain -abdomen.Bbac& breath# SelfBdefence( namely combat# @ne should &now that a big mo ement is not as good as a small mo ement, a small mo ement is not as good as stillness, one must &now that only stillness is the endless mo ement# /f the body mo es, that is "ust an e%pression of immobility and lac& of strength, what is called mo ement in stillness, is mo ing as if one was not mo ing, the mo ement and stillness are the basis of each other, and the wonders of their application mostly depend on the ner ous system being connected, the mind leading, the big and small "oints and ligaments e%tending and contracting mutually, the fulcrum being firm li&e iron, ha ing twisting and opposite strengths,rotating around the pi ot point, mo ing the centre in a balanced way, and issuing the e%plosi e power together with the breath# /f one can e%ert it properly, one has the basis of combat# What was said abo e was mostly abstract, but much of its meaning cannot be described in words# /f one can &eep practising unceasingly, then it is naturally not difficult to realise# What is the distinction between the so called big mo ement and small mo ement, in fact, depends on indi idual basic s&ills, and whether all &inds of strengths are being gained by the body and understood by the mind or not# /f one can raise the hands and mo e the feet with the whole body ha ing mechanical s&ills e erywhere, then a big mo ement is fine, a small mo ement is fine as well, and a mo ement that is neither big nor small is also equally fine# /f one does not ha e the basic mechanical ability, then no matter what the mo ement is li&e, it is all wrong# The same applies to using strength and not using strength# The mo ements of an ordinary person cannot ha e strength without constant unilateral tension that disturbs the blood circulation# D ery &ind of strength based on constant unilateral tension is stiff and inharmonious, and besides that, harmful to health# ?a ing strength without constant unilateral tension is namely ha ing strength without using strength, and when using it, one gains strength# That is what the natural instincti e strength is li&e# /t is li&e see&ing all &inds of real things from the unreal, which is hardly possible to e%press in words# +nyway, Dachengquan2 is beyond the e%ternal form of being good or bad, it actually depends on dealing with the mind# /n a nutshell, ha ing a fi%ed form and fi%ed techniques are all false, s&ills reaching the le el of noBmind are getting ery rare, this is what the abo e means#

-9. /nter iewer( / thin& there must ha e been many isitors calling on you since the last time your iews appeared in a newspaper# Were there any brilliant persons of unusual ability0 Wang Xiang1hai( /2m ery gratified that you care and introduce me to the readers# +mong the martial artists of !ei"ing , there still was not a single person willing to come and grant me instruction# !ut the numerous letters coming from all quarters of the country e%pressed that there are many people who hold me in fa our and esteem# ,oreo er, there were some people from some places who came here to bargain, wishing to be appointed to the position of an instructor#$urthermore there was an incident that / can tell you about# 4ecently, there were ery many people who were seriously researching combat science and see&ing for ad ice# ,ost came to as& for

instruction by their own initiati e and there were also those who were introduced by someone else# That is the only reason / ad ocate combat science# / ha e no intention of contending with others, moreo er, / scorn contention# / wish to help all the countrymen who are interested in combat science to understand it, and also hope that the combat science legislation will be reformed completely# Lictory or defeat should not be ta&en as honour or disgrace# / wish that other bo%ers would not consider themsel es to always be right "ust by studying blindly and practising rec&lessly# / especially hope that all bo%ers will become healthy pugilists# / do not wish them to become martial artists wandering from place to place ma&ing a li ing with their tric&s# !ut nowadays, out of one hundred bo%ers, not e en one has anything right at all# >oo&ing at them, / mostly get the feeling that it is all completely wrong# +s for the bo%ers who rely on bo%ing to ma&e their li ing, they "ust should not feel ashamed of studying again from others after they ha e started teaching# They should not be hard on themsel es in spirit, but try hard to follow those who e%cel o er them# They must &eep in mind that they should not mislead and harm their students# Nowadays, bo%ers do not &now where the spirit of combat science is# While they ha e no alternati e but to ma&e their li ing with it, surely they should not instruct people with mystery and iolence# That way they might not commit the great error of going as far from the truth as the hea en is from the deep sea# !ut then again, the wea&nesses of these men are too numerous and they cannot be easily influenced o er a short period of time# / only hope that they will become conscious of the truth and start to selfBe%amine themsel es bit by bit, nothing more#

-M. /nter iewer( Since the martial way arose, many schools ha e been born, each ad ocating its own way so that e entually the students end up with a feeling of ignorance# What is legitimate after all0 Wang Xiang1hai( +ll learning in the world depends on comparison, only that way can good and bad be distinguished, otherwise e ery school will claim to be right, and the laymen will ha e difficulties distinguishing right and wrong# The correctness of bo%ing cannot be "udged merely by the criterion of ictory or defeat, it must be "udged by whether it is reasonable and suitable to the human needs or not# What is reasonable is achie ing comfort, gaining strength, and getting 1est into one2s life# /f one does not achie e comfort, gain strength, and if the study does not bring 1est into one2s life, then it cannot be called bo%ing# Whether one &nows of the history of bo%ing or not does not matter at all, one should only see whether there is any alue in regard to learning and whether it accords with the requirements of life# !ut spea&ing of the combat science of our nation, it has a centuriesBold history# /t began re ealing its brilliance in the Warring States =eriod 7G)3 !E B <<' !E:, and gradually ad anced and e ol ed# During the times of the Tang and Song dynasties, bo%ing started to turn into technical s&ills and different styles started to e ol e# During the Yuan, ,ing, and early 6ing dynasties, the different schools were most popular# There were ery many practitioners, and only because their strength, s&ill, and attainments were different and some being wise and others stupid, bo%ing bro&e into different schools,

each claiming its teachings as correct# Those schools are namely what are now called the arious styles# During the reigns of Iang%i and Yong1heng of the 6ing dynasty 7'**< B '93H:, firearms were not yet pre alent# The emperors feared that the martial arts would be used against the go ernment, therefore they wanted to destroy them for good and so that they could ne er reco er# Therefore they started to influence the people to thin& highly of the ci il arts and loo& down upon e erything martial# @n one hand they ad ocated flying immortal swordsmen and taught the mystical on purpose, on the other hand they praised the bo%ing forms and fi%ed techniques in order to lead the martial arts astray# The middle road and the great Tao could not be as&ed about, and they used opera and storyboo&s to ser e as their tools of propaganda# $urthermore they made the people who practised martial arts to be despised by the scholarBbureaucrats, so the situation went from bad to e en worse# +ll &inds of ugly performances emerged, what a great pity and tragedy# >uc&ily our combat science predecessors secretly had successors, and they succeeded in ha ing a gleam of light sur i e# +lthough training halls were set up all o er the country to ad ocate the martial arts during the last twenty years, the more they were ad ocated, the sooner they would be lost, ne er being able to return to the right path of combat science# /n fact, learning bo%ing is not difficult, but because the brains of the ordinary people are tormented by the storyboo&s, and furthermore, because the bo%ers of modern times mostly do it for li ing, the combat science is completely at loss# D en if some people are conscious of that, they are still too ashamed to study from others, and thus ha e no way out# During the last half of the year, the other bo%ers ha e come to me to compare their s&ills in combat# / will not point out who they were, in order to let them &eep their ways of ma&ing a li ing# Now they mostly understand that they were wrong, but why do they not agree to come and discuss the martial arts openly, and furthermore, why are they not willing to compare their s&ills in combat, in order to impro e their learning0 @n the contrary, they go against their conscience and claim others to be wrong# They do nothing but secretly create absurd tales, and still they pretend being ignorant of those tales# What do they do that for0 +s for the nonBprofessional martial artists, they want to become mysterious bo%ers by creating these tales, being li&e theatregoers not well ersed in drama, they are not able to do anything but throw punches at random to show off their s&ills# That is really something to be despised# /n case my words are considered erroneous, can the nonprofessional bo%ing students agree to grant me instruction0 $urthermore, / wish to ha e small friendly tests of s&ills in combat, and e en if the people who come to me ha e no martial s&ills at all, / will not insult them, and / will not tell about them to other people in order not to harm their business# /f one cannot come to isit me to grant me instruction, then please tell me the place and the time, and / will come to pay my respects on time# /f one has e en a tiny strong point, / will do my utmost to gi e him publicity, and if one has no strong points at all, / will &eep my mouth shut# /f one always considers oneself as a top bo%er behind closed doors, that is not worth a penny# -8. /nter iewer( / ha e heard your discussion pointing out the right path of our national arts# You ha e introduced something new, and a fresh approach in see&ing the good of e eryone pursuing the same things, but / thin& you went a bit too far in some of your critique towards Tai"iquan2# Wang Xiang1hai( ,y understanding of the Tao is still shallow, / do not dare to say that / ha e introduced something new, / "ust follow and spread the tradition of the predecessors, nothing more# There are many more things, but / feel embarrassed to say them because /

ha e many good friends practising Tai"i2# +lso, this bo%ing is less abused than most of the others, and has more sensible practitioners, thus / freely criticise it# / would ha e already stopped discussing about it a long time ago otherwise# Tal&ing of criticism, / am afraid that among the Tai"i2 practitioners, those who will ne er understand combat science are fearfully many, and those who are far from being learned masters are e en more numerous# /n my childhood / heard of the fame of the Taoist ;hang Sanfeng# ?a ing grown up, / tra elled all around the country, so / &now that among all the schools of bo%ing, Tai"i2 has the biggest amount of practitioners# / had already been doubtful of this bo%ing for a long time# / heard this bo%ing was handed down from ,r# ;hang Sanfeng, thus / had despised Sanfeng for a long time# >ater / read the collected edition of ,r# Sanfeng2s teachings, and began to realise that he had ad anced all along the great Tao# ?e had already gone deep into the Sea of >aw and profoundly realised absolute truth# ?owe er, / e en more deeply belie e that such bo%ing was not handed down from him# +ctually, if it was or was not does not matter at all, because, e en if one was the descendant of Sanfeng, one is not worthy to tal& about his art if one has not gained its essence# / do not &now who were the successors of ,r# Sanfeng, but / suppose they were inferior to Sanfeng# /f they had been capable, why would they ha e misled others0 Whether the teachings gained by the students are true or false is the &ey# ,oreo er, nowadays the practitioners of this bo%ing are different from each other and the theories ary# /t is all random and falseJ / remember that ,r# Sanfeng said( >ea ing one2s own body is wrong, but clinging to one2s own body is much worse# Tai"iquan2 has one hundred and forty or fifty postures, is there any posture or method that is not being clung to0 What are these postures for0 ,oreo er, the spirit is firmly bound and cannot be liberated# /t is indeed harmful to the freedom of the ner es, the limbs, and the trun&# 4emembering how wise ,r# Sanfeng was, he should not ha e gone so far as to hand down Tai"iquan2 that is so improper# Discussing the wordy content of the Theory of Tai"iquan2, the single and double weighting and e en weighting, and all such profound things are also nothing more than a part of the rudiments of combat science# ,ay / as& the famous Tai"i2 masters to e%amine their conscience, whether there can be e en a single posture or method in accord with the theories of this bo%ing guide0 Since they claim it to be supreme combat science, why does it not produce any results in practice0 $urthermore, the practitioners of this bo%ing belie e that they can gain good bo%ing s&ills with superstitious practises# This is e en more absurd# D en if all the methods of this bo%ing would e%cel o er the others, and the s&ills would tower abo e the ordinary, there is no doubt that it would still be wrong on the spiritual side, and besides, that is not the case# +lthough Tai"iquan2 is practised by a huge amount of people, which has gi en it much publicity, the sensible people ha e long &nown that it has collapsed of itself# =erhaps there was something improper in my words, / really hope that the other martial artists will question me without any hesitation, if there is someone who can instruct me, / will sweep the pathway to welcome him# -'). /nter iewer( Sir, you criticised the shortcomings of Tai"iquan2, / certainly ha e to admit, but / also ha e many friends who ha e gained good health by practising this bo%ing, / am afraid that your critique is somewhat inappropriate# Wang Xiang1hai( The alue of combat science is not only in rela%ation and other trifling achie ements# @ne must &now that combat science is persistent learning, which is a human need and one cannot learn it thoroughly in a ery short time# Therefore ;huang1i said(

,artial arts do indeed enter the Tao# They are the basis of culture and arts, they are the lifeblood of ;en and philosophy# /f "ust a tiny result could represent bo%ing, then there would be no need to obser e and study combat science# /f one stic&s to the practice of bo%ing in the way you said, it will produce some results# $urthermore, one should &now that if one can ta&e the time to practise bo%ing, do it without any method, freely and slowly percei ing by intuition, then the results will be great# / dare to say they will be much more than what you mentioned # -''. /nter iewer( The different schools of bo%ing are e%tremely numerous and their theories differ# +mong my good friends there are many who practise bo%ing# Some of them practise according to boo&s, but none of them has gained any results# What &ind of a boo& should they adopt0 Wang Xiang1hai( Eombat science cannot be di ided into schools, and the bo%ing theory does not ha e the distinction of Ehinese or foreign, and new or old# Do nothing but e%amine whether it is right or wrong, and suitable or unsuitable, that is enough# +t large, the numerous schools of our society, generally ta&e the approach of forms and techniques to learn bo%ing# @ne must &now that this &ind practice is "ust forgery conducted by the later generations, it is not the original essence of combat science# D en though a few people by chance realise some sideBmechanics and oneBsided techniques, they ha e not, howe er, left the methods and forms after all, so it is without a ail in the end# +s for the writers of the martial arts guide boo&s, they cannot e%ceed this boundary either# +lthough this doctrine is ery easy to study, it is still not as simple as following others li&e sheep# Sometimes those who are taught by a famous master who passed the &nowledge orally and from the heart, still cannot differentiate between right and wrong after do1ens of years# ?ow could these writings then be of any use0 /n any &ind of learning, one should first understand the fundamental principle, and bit by bit intuiti ely percei e the s&ills, starting from the basics# /n addition to that, one should ponder carefully, ma&ing a clear distinction between right and wrong, and pro ing one2s perceptions by e%perimenting in many ways# @nly then can one mo e on to study those technical s&ills# @ne should a oid training in front of a mirror, because this way one can easily become similar in form but untrue in spirit# Those training according to boo&s are really the blind being led by the blind# Then again, by reading a boo& one can collect the crystalli1ation of all sorts of theories, not paying any attention to the postures and form# +ccording to the sur ey of my thirty years of teaching, this branch of learning is e%tremely difficult yet also e%tremely easy# + gifted student, in less than one hundred days of e%ercise, has the hope to become a great learned master, but among one hundred students there is not e en one or two of them, and in most cases the talented sagacious people lac& honesty and tolerance, some of them are e en shams and cheaters# Therefore most are abandoned halfway by their teachers, this is also a pityJ +s for the common students of our society, their difficulties are really lamentable# ,ost people always belie e their ears instead of their eyes# The two words, fame and fact, cannot be mentioned in the same sentence# D en though the amount of bo%ers in the world is uncountable, those who ha e gained the essence are rare li&e a unicorn2s horn# +ll of those who ha e gained the essence are ery different from the ordinary people in character# They cannot be enticed by fame or attracted by benefit, and they would ne er associate with the hypocritesJ $inding a master is ery difficult indeed#

D en if you meet a wise master how can you differentiate whether he is wise or not, and then he is not necessarily willing to teach you# D en if he agrees to teach you, he does not necessarily ha e a good method of teaching# !e it that he has a good teaching method, it is still not certain that one can realise the essence of his teachings# There e%ist a ariety of difficulties that an ine%perienced person cannot &now# Then again, nowadays it is easier to study than before, because the science is flourishing# /t helps ery much in understanding the principles of combat science, but still, combat science cannot be limited to this# /f it is e%plained with the hierarchy of science and local anatomy, then it should be the one and the only way and phase of studying# !ut there are still many principles in our combat science that cannot be e%plained, but after some years they might be pro ed by science# >earning &nows no limits, perhaps there are no means to e er e%plain it, this cannot be &nown# Summed up, if discussed under the conditions and &nowledge of today, one should add a scientific method to the spirit of combat science, then it will not be difficult to sol e the problems in combat science# -'<. /nter iewer( 4epeatedly in their comments, the readers did not deny your theory, but they feltuneasy studying without forms and routines, especially the beginnersJ Wang Xiang1hai( The human body has all &inds of functionsN no wise man can e%haust them all e en if practising all his life# What is the reason to abandon the essence and study the scum0 The more one studies the methods of forms and routines the farther one will be from the truth# That is li&e binding the feet of the women, the more profound one2s s&ill is, the more difficult it is to e%tend the feet, therefore the beginners ad ance much faster than the eterans# This argument has been pro ed by many irrefutable e%amples# The theory created by the later generations where a certain posture breeds a certain strength, and a certain method o ercomes a certain bo%ing s&ill is real magniloquence resulting in decei ing the people# / am afraid that the one who claims such things has no understanding of bo%ing at all# -'3. /nter iewer( What you said, Sir, is ery right, and the martial arts are indeed at a loss# Would you teach e erybody a simple and con enient way to succeed, that people could easily produce results with0 Wang Xiang1hai( + general idea of health preser ation was already outlined abo e# /f one is willing to do as ad ised, then one has already ad anced halfway on the path of health preser ation# /f one wants to study the profound s&ills of combat, then one must also go through that, but if one is not an e%tremely foolish person or great sage, one will not be willing to do so# /f one is a genius or has a character close to that of the sages, then there is no need to study all those methods# +lso the methods of combat ha e pile standing 71han1huang: and trial of strength 7shili: as the basis# / already narrated their general ideas abo e# The methods of trial of strength are too numerous, and besides, after all &inds of strengths are gained by the body, one should not thin& that the way of combat has been completed# +t that point one has "ust begun to ha e the possibility of studying combat# $or e%ample, how to gain the mastery of Finteraction of rela%ation and tension ne er not being correct, and the interaction of oid and solid coming to equilibriumF is another problem# +nyway, after finding a teacher, the profundity or shallowness of one2s attainments indeed depend on one2s indi idual talent, strength, and s&ill, and whether one can grasp the right timing to be able to launch an attac& at any moment, but without much e%perience in actual combat, it is hardly possible to gain it#

-'G. /nter iewer( / ha e heard many martial artists saying( F/f you do not use strength, how can you increase it0 None of the ancient and modern masters neglected the enriching of the dantian qi, and only because of that, could they be successful#F Wang Xiang1hai( The theory of using strength is the tal& of laymen# There are also those who speciously support the theory of not using strength, but do not &now what it means after all# @ne must &now that not to use strength is correct, but not to use the mind is incorrect# /f one uses strength then the internal organs die, the body becomes ineffecti e, stiff, stupid, and easy to be ta&en ad antage of by others# /n other words, it is "ust a disguised form of passi e resistance# The idea of resisting is produced by the fear of being hit by the ad ersary, but in this way one is completely ignorant of the fact that the spirit has already accepted to be hit# ?ow could one then not get hit by the ad ersary0 Therefore, using strength is a great taboo in combat science# +s for the theory of the dantian qi, from the theoretical point of iew, field tests, and my own perception from e%perience and obser ation, this theory does not seem proper# Within the abdomen there are the intestines, the stomach, and the li er, there is no place to fill with the qi# +s for the functions of force, they are all effects of the opposite power, the e%plosi e power, and the power of the uni erse combined, and e%erted together with breath that ma&es the body bulge and undulate, open and close, and the body and spirit being integrated with the atmosphere in oneAs mind# That has nothing to do with what the people call the qi of qigong# They always ta&e a potbelly as dantian qi, that is "ust e%tremely wrong# @ne must &now that when e%erted, the strength must be issued e enly and completely# /n order to be entirely free from worry and to gain strength, one should also be at leisure and natural, that is "ust being reasonable# The students of modern times do not understand this truth, they spend do1ens of years wor&ing hard, and instead of gaining li ely bodies and minds from the training, they become machines# /s that not a great pityJ -'H. /nter iewer( +lthough your critique is appropriate, it is still always the same combat arena, and if you, in the long run, accidentally misstep in one of the challenge fights, then what0 Wang Xiang1hai( ?ow would / dare to gi e an open challenge, / do not e en dare to act as the ringleader for challenge# / "ust wish that my fellow bo%ers would be willing to ad ocate, discuss, and in estigate combat science li&e this, then it would not be difficult to carry it forward in the future# ?owe er, if nobody does this, / wish to start from myself, with nothing else other than ad ising the others with earnest words and good intentions, and often in"ecting cardiotonic shots into the arms of the other bo%ers of our country in order to little by little cure their illness of paralysis, / offer a few commonplace remar&s by way of introduction so that others may come up with aluable opinions# D en if my body be full of cuts and bruises, my utmost wish will come true if combat science can be promoted# -'*. /nter iewer( =eople generally accepted your tal&s, but there were still some who were liberal in their condemnation of you# Wang Xiang1hai( Those who understand me are wise people, those who condemn me should sit alone in the still of night to listen to their hearts# +nyhow, let them laugh who will, / will not mind# /f the true essence of combat science will prosper again, how could personal praise or blame ma&e any difference0

-'9. /nter iewer( ?ow can the ordinary people dare to disagree with your &nowledge and irtue0 Wang Xiang1hai( What you said is right, / am ery ashamed, but our countrymen ha e already become socially reser ed# ?onesty and prudence are really the basis of the selfB culti ation of learning and morals, in other words( being solid inside and oid outside, or firm outside and nimble inside# That is "ust the same principle as that of >ao1i, OThe desireless one can see the essence, while the desiring one only sees its manifestation#O !ut somehow it is made use of by the people# /t has already become the talisman of those who ma&e their li ing by decei ing others# >ies in the society are also created by such people# / ha e tra elled all around the country for almost forty years, often feeling that there is only the art of Oopera actingO that does not put up with the society# @pera does not allow the laymen to assume positions in it either, but there are many styles of opera which all differ, / do not &now all of them# +s for what is called honesty and prudence toward others, / thin& one should act according to the other party, there should not be any unreasonable politeness# >i&e the sages of the past, respectfully ser e others and be honest and sincere, o ercome your desires and show lo e to others# / am ery glad to comply with that as the teachings of the boo&s of good intercourse and treating each other with respect cannot be seen nowadays# / do not deser e praise for my learning and morals# /n studying morals / only put myself under the patronage of the important people# What is called Tao is the truth that is all per ading and comple%, and the only proper course to ta&e# /n other words, is it reasonable or unreasonable0 4easonable is namely the Tao and unreasonable is not the Tao# /t is not a mystical and strange thing, it is not the poor superstitious chapters and erses of the ulgar and pedantic literati either# /t has especially nothing to do with the eccentric people, who pretend insaneness, calling that the doctrine of !uddhism and Taoism in order to loo& different, they cannot e en dream about the gate to the great Tao# /f one does not understand the society, / ha e no choice but to retain tal&ing about other things with him# -'M. /nter iewer( You said that there are still many places in opera where the essence has not been lost, which are far ahead of the a erage schools of bo%ing# / do not understand on what ground you can say that, / feel that this comment is rather improper# Wang Xiang1hai( @pera was originally meant to subsidy the shortcomings of education, all of its martial performances originated from the way of bo%ing# /n bo%ing there was originally the qiba 7pulling the body: e%ercise, which is one of the s&ills of shili 7trial of strength:# 6iba is see&ing the pi oting strength of the barycentres of the erte% and the two feet, ma&ing the whole body e%tend equally and completely, becoming one with the uni erse, therefore named qiba e%ercise# /n opera it is mista&enly called Frising of the dominationF, but watching their postures and the meaning of their theories, although they are not proper, they are not far from that either, thus we &now that it has some essence# +s for all &inds of postures which try to please the eye and win peopleAs adoration, they are all forged# @f the postures of today2s bo%ers / ha e not seen a single one that would ha e gained equilibrium, e en the old eterans and young 0lites turn into imitating the untruthful and childish ones, and some of them cannot e en succeed in that, how could they e er see the profundity of the martial way0

-'8. /nter iewer( / suppose that recently there was no lac& of people as&ing for ad ice# What is your sentiment, Sir0 Wang Xiang1hai( +lthough there were many people from all circles who came to see me these days, they were all "ust curious people and what they tal&ed about was not related to combat science# +s for the isitor pursuing the same way, none of them was the &ind of person / e%pected# -<). /nter iewer( What did you e%pect then0 Wang Xiang1hai( +lthough / am incompetent, / really e%pected the isitors to test me with difficult questions to the best of their abilities# To discuss what is reasonable in combat science and its important connection with life, and to pay attention to see&ing the true spirit of the martial way# +lthough combat is "ust a trifling s&ill, without it the results cannot be pro ed, therefore / am also ready to ha e friendly comparisons of s&ills in combat# These days there were many small things, thus / could not personally meet all the isitors one by one# / am ashamed of that, and thus from now on, / plan to also fi% reception times for Wednesdays and $ridays, from three o2cloc& to si% o2cloc& # -<'. /nter iewer( What do your fellow bo%ers thin& of that0 Wang Xiang1hai( /n order to research the true essence of combat science in its entirety, / already cling to disregarding derision and taunts, and will ne er promote the supernatural# / always support altruism, / do not worry about there being no one coming to grant me instruction or as&ing for ad ice# What / worry about is that the famous masters do not inspect and learn from each other and discuss the problems# / fear it is hardly possible to gain the hope of combat science succeeding# +nyway, / hope that combat science will ad ance, polish up the goal of the martial way of our society, and wash off the deep rooted bad habits# / am not concerned about other things# -<<. /nter iewer( The con ersation with you that was published in a newspaper last time has caused quite a stir# / suppose that there was no lac& of isitors# Were there any pursuing the same way as you0 Wang Xiang1hai( / was granted the fa our of not being abandoned by the society, there was indeed no lac& of isitors, but most of them came to learn from me, there were only two gentlemen pursuing the same way, >u ;hi"ie and Shao ;efen from $engtai, who wanted to do pushBhands 7tuishou:, which is nothing more than what the e%perts call Flistening to strengthF# There were no others, furthermore no one agreed to enter into combat# The method of pushBhands is only a onesided part of the way of bo%ing, it is not what / welcome# +s for the famous masters in !ei"ing , there was not a single person willing to come to instruct me, that is really not what / e%pected# / do not understand why the other bo%ers do not want to contact me# What / ha e always respected are the martial morals, therefore courtesy must come first, so there are also some limits, namely, the old people / modestly decline, the modest and gentle people modestly decline, the incompetent people / modestly decline# /f you do not belie e in my words, please as& those who came to isit me and you will &now# When ,r# >u isited me for the first time, we did a little pushBhands and he too& my s&ill only as such, and thus was not con inced# >ater he started to isit frequently and started to

realise that there was a huge difference between our s&ills, and now he has become a faithful disciple of mine# -<3. /nter iewer( ?ow many people are there among our martial arts predecessors that you admire0 Wang Xiang1hai( D%amining the bo%ing predecessors of the last one hundred years, besides Dong ?aichuan, Ehe Yi1hai, and 5uo Yunshen, these three masters, all the others are of minor importance, but our country is huge and has a big population, there are still many people pursuing the martial way who / ha e not met# / do not dare to ma&e comments at random # -<G. /nter iewer( The people often mention Yang >uchan, how was his learning0 Wang Xiang1hai( ,r# >uchan was a combat science predecessor as well, he was s&illed in Tai"i2, and now most people follow his lineage# What / tal& about has to be obser ed from e ery aspect, >uchan only achie ed a part of the Tao, e en ,r# Wang ;ongyue of the ,ing dynasty was not a complete e%pert# ,r# ;ongyue obtained the oneBsided part of pushBhands with both hands, originating from 5eneral Yue $ei, changed the three fists into thirteen postures, and named it Tai"i2# There is no way to do te%tual research on what was handed down from ;hang Sanfeng and the people would "ust draw wrong conclusions from it# +s for the one hundred and forty or fifty postures, / ha e no idea where they originated from# !ut tal&ing of the practice of this bo%ing, it does not only abuse the limbs and the trun&, but also does infinite harm to the spirit, it is still ery far from the art of actual combat, they ha e nothing in common with each other# -<H. /nter iewer( You ha e frequently published commentary on bo%ing in the newspapers, how ha e others pursuing the same path reacted to that0 ?a e you e er heard0 Wang Xiang1hai( The sensible people pursuing the same path accepted it without an e%ception# +s for the conser ati e people who cannot differentiate between right and wrong, / ha e no choice but to let them ha e their own way# D en if one can understand, it is still not easy to put it into practice, and it is e en more difficult for those who cannot differentiate between right or wrong at all# ?owe er, the ordinary bo%ers still ta&e e%ercising the body as the catchword and stop tal&ing about combat# Watching that, one can also &now that the way of combat, compared to health preser ation, is a ery trifling thing# The way of health preser ation relies on concentrating oneAs spirit and nourishing oneAs nature# The mind becomes empty and unifiedN that is called the art of one2s body and mind, life and nature# With this mo ement and that posture, springing forward and "umping bac&ward, it is really difficult to e en dream about entering the gate of health preser ation# /n fact health preser ation is simple and easy# True human nature lo es naturalness and unrestricted free mo ement, the whole offshoot of the natural instincts are the basis of that# D ery morning in the fresh air, without any method, "ust let the "oints of the whole body be slightly bent, consider the s&y, mo e slowly and freely, e%perience and obser e the intestinal qi and the flow of blood# +t the same time, intuiti ely percei e the e%ternal oid and nimble opposing strength# This is called the spirit resembles as if it was swimming#

The spirit and the body are comfortable and natural, not only free and unrestricted, but also gradually realising the echo of nature# +fter a long time of training, the instincts un eil and the rays of the spirit will shine, one will ha e gained the basis of combat e en without ha ing thought of them# /f one always stic&s to mechanical mo ement, plays around with a staff and performs with a spear see&ing beauty, ta&ing that as the glory of being good in martial arts, then one does not &now that if a man of insight sees that, he will feel sic& for ten days# That is terrible, such a person cannot comprehend bo%ing for life# -<*. /nter iewer( Your purpose is studying truth and de eloping the martial arts, why were there so few isitors0 Ean you thin& of a reason0 Wang Xiang1hai( /t is ery difficult to find an answer for this# +ccording to my con"ecture, in the martial arts circles of our country there are no doubt many wise ones, but the unworthy ones are especially numerous# D eryone studying a certain style of martial arts, assiduously practises for many years and flatters oneself by claiming that one alone has accomplished the profound s&ills, and then calls oneself the successor of that school# This way one will e en be respected by the society, so one can sol e the problem of ma&ing a li ing at the same time# @nce such people are told to abandon all their learning and start studying from the beginning, it is really intolerable for them# =erhaps their way of ma&ing a li ing would also be affected by that, thus they consider their personal ad antages and disad antages, and notice that the disad antages would be huge, therefore it is no wonder that the isitors were so sparse# The most fortunate thing in the end is that there are some ignorant people, who do not dare to measure or discuss right and wrong, and thus "ust ma&e gossip at random, ma&ing irresponsible remar&s in order to hide their wea& points# The people in our society trust them and the people who ha e been decei ed by them are really numerous, this is a great pity# /f we do not wipe out this obstacle, the martial arts of our country will hardly ha e any hope of a quiet and great progress# -<9. /nter iewer( Sir, you are the forerunner in the martial arts, and you are holding the decision in your hands# $urthermore, / hope you will &eep on wor&ing with perse erance, then the martial arts will surely ha e no difficulties in seeing the days of glory and progress# Wang Xiang1hai( Your words touch me deeply, naturally / shall do my utmost# Success or failure, praise or blame, / do not dare to care for them# There is only one goal, namely to sol e the question of how combat science can ad ance# Therefore / tell other bo%ers here( originally combat was "ust a minor s&ill, but the ordinary people mostly "udge one2s bo%ing s&ills by the relati e superiority or inferiority in combat, therefore there are two research methods# /f one is willing to research the suitability of each action, then / immensely welcome him# /f one wants to enter into combat or do pushBhands, they are both fine as well# The scope of researching combat science is e%tensi e# /f the amount of isitors will increase, then there will be no dilemma# /f the isitor has e en tiny strong points, / will certainly do my utmost to bla1on forth and praise him# /f he has no strong points at all, / will certainly say nothing, because e en tal&ing cannot ma&e him understand# / really hope that the isitors will test me with difficult questions to the best of their abilities, in order to compare e%periences with each other, aiming at the progress of combat science, e eryone pursuing the same way with me, all should shoulder the duty to de elop combat science#

This important prospect should definitely not be wea&ened because of personal reasons, if it can really benefit the general interest# D en if one has to suffer any personal sacrifices, one should still gi e up something small to achie e something great# / maintain this determination, if combat science can thereby progress, it would not only be an indi idual gain, but also the whole world and our descendants would benefit greatly# The reporter and ,r# Wang finished their con ersation, and because it was already late, they bid farewell to each other and left# /n the '8G)As Yiquan2 was &nown as Dachengquan2# >ater ,r# Wang Xiang1hai dropped the name Dachengquan2 and as&ed his students to return to the old name as well# +ll of ,r# WangAs top students did that, but some people still &ept using the name Dachengquan2# Thus Yiquan2 and Dachengquan2 are "ust two names for one art#

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