The True Meaning of Life by Periander A. Esplana

THE
MEANING
OF
LIFE
Annotated Chronicles of Discussion of
A Biblical Christian Against Skeptics,
Critics, Atheists, New Agers, and
Mystics On the Meaning of Life
PERIANDER A. ESPLANA
www.geocities.com/perianthium786
THE MEANING OF LIFE PERIANDER A. ESPLANA
God Shall Reveal Even This Unto You
“7 But what things were gain to me, those I counted loss for Christ.
8 Yea doubtless, and I count all things but loss for the excellency of the knowledge of
Christ Jesus my Lord: for whom I have suffered the loss of all things,
and do count them but dung, that I may win Christ,
9 And be found in him, not having mine own righteousness, which is of the law, but
that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is of God by faith:
10 That I may know him, and the power of his resurrection, and the fellowship of his
sufferings, being made conformable unto his death;
11 If by any means I might attain unto the resurrection of the dead.
12 Not as though I had already attained, either were already perfect: but I follow
after, if that I may apprehend that for which also I am apprehended of Christ Jesus.
13 Brethren, I count not myself to have apprehended: but this one thing I do,
forgetting those things which are behind, and reaching forth unto
those things which are before,
14 I press toward the mark for the prize of the high calling of God in Christ Jesus.
15 Let us therefore, as many as be perfect, be thus minded: and if in any thing ye be

otherwise minded, God shall reveal even this unto you.”
- Paul the Apostle of the Gentiles

(Philippians Chapter Three)
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THE MEANING OF LIFE

Annotated Chronicles of Discussion of
A Biblical Christian Against Skeptics, Critics, Atheists,
New Agers, and Mystics On the Meaning of Life
PERIANDER A. ESPLANA
Eight years ago, I joined and participated in an on-line forum/debate at

http://www.lostinthecosmos.com on the meaning of life. I have reproduced in this book
those on-line discussions as they exactly appeared in the Internet including typographical
errors. I just changed the names with descriptions that they represented and replaced the
dates with numbers (from #1 to #124) for the sake of clarity, brevity and continuity. Red
#s refer to my posts. These discussions on the meaning of life started on Friday, 4
February 2000, at 5:16 p.m. and ended on Tuesday, 7 March 2000, at 9:12 a.m.
My annotations can be seen at the bottom of each page in italics with numbers
(#_) to point out the specific response that I had given comments. In this book, I have
included boxed citations on the meaning of life from different Christian books which can
be used for devotional reading and personal bible study.
Perhaps, it was three or four years ago that the original www.lostinthecosmos.com
website became inaccessible on-line. Its Webmaster had his own personal reason for
doing so. I’ve waited for so long that it will become available again on-line but until now
the original website is still inaccessible. That’s why this book become necessary so that
those Net surfers who have not yet visited that website may have the privilege to witness
the on-line “debate” between me and infidels with regards to the real meaning of life.
Cosmos Chat Participants/Discussants/Debaters on the Meaning of Life:

Biblical Christian = Periander A. Esplana
Truth-seeker One = Ryazanaban
Truth-seeker Two = Ciao
Skeptic One = Joe
Skeptic Two = Phil
Critic = Chris
Atheist = Louis Acosta
Christian One = Josh McDowell
Christian Two = Angel Diaz
Mystic = Twist or Adam
New Ager One = Shelly
New Ager Two = James
Professing Christian = Brandon
3
Before I joined this forum, as I browsed the thread of responses, I noticed that
they are talking non-sense because one opinion is trying to refute another opinion. Without
any absolute criterion of right and wrong, without adequate basis of true and false, and
without ultimate standard to explain good and evil, all of them are wandering in the jokedom
of opinionated opinion that destined to end in vanity of vanities.
I was obliged to present the true truth to them. Not “truths” and “realities”
according to their whims and fantasies but truth and reality according to the Truth of
truths and Reality of realities. As you will see, when I entered all infidels united together
to attack and devour me but they all tragically failed. Truth always prevails. Good always
prevail over evil. At the end, righteousness defeated unrighteousness.
Here is a true to life, real life chronicle of discussions on the meaning of life. A
true account of what this world believed today against its Creator. You’ll be amazed to
witness how infidels will try to defend their belief-system no matter how absurd it is when
measured in the light of truth and reality in order to justify their sins and unrighteousness.
You’ll see that all infidels or Bible-rejecters (atheist, critic, skeptic, mystic, New
Ager, etc.) are narrow-minded, bigoted, deluded, paranoid, and schizophrenic. They thought
that they are smart enough to criticize the perfect Word of God. They blindly believed
that they are self-sufficient that’s why they complacency think that they have the guts to
reject the God Who created, preserves and will redeem all things. They foolishly thought
that their limited knowledge of reality is the entire reality itself. Their self-delusion
becomes the measure of all things. They make “gods” out of themselves. In short, idolatry.
They worship their opinion, speculation, mind, and experiences.
It is my prayer that the light of God’s self-revelation may shine upon you as you
read the following chronicles. May the life of Jesus who lives a life of love bless you to the
utmost. May the love of God’s Spirit dwell in you richly so that you can live the meaningful
meaning of livable life.
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#1
Posted by Truth-seeker One
(Answered by Skeptic One at #2 and by Biblical Christian at #3)
I think most of you are familiar with my feelings on the lack of meaning in life. Recently I have read posts
between religion’s usefulness (gives people meaning for life) or foolishness (wastes time). I became
curious as to what others’ personal opinions on the meaning of life are. Anyone wish to share some
personal ideas?
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______________
#1 I believed that Ryazanaban the truth-seeker is really honest on his inquiry about the meaning of life that’s why I was
obliged to give my response on this issue. Most of the posts were really confusing. Even though he was asking for
“others’ personal opinions” or “personal ideas” but the truth is that you will never know the meaning of life by means
of personal opinions/ideas or man’s speculation because the answer can only be found by God’s revelation.
Obviously, most of the participants have given only their own opinions and nothing more. By God’s grace, I gave them
the only answer that can be found in the Word of God (the Bible) who is no other than the Lord and Saviour Jesus
Christ. He is the Ultimate Solution, the Final Answer and the Absolute Explanation to all things. He alone is the very
meaning of our life. Without Him, everything is futile, meaningless and utterly worthless.
4
#2 ~∞~
Posted by Skeptic One In Response to #1 “You were made by God and
(Answered by Biblical Christian at #3)
Everyone has very different meaning of life, depends who you for God – and until you
ask. From a personal point of view, I believe life is to enjoy. understand that,
I am very curious person and luckily life is full of questions
and mysteries. I think life will be very boring if we knew life will never make sense.”
answers to every question. First of all origin of life, origin of – Rick Warren, The Purpose-Driven Life,
universe and if there’s God, origin of God are some of the Grand Rapids: Zondervan, 2002, p.18.
questions I am sure we can spend life time trying to answer ~∞~
these questions.
To me the most puzzling question is why anything exists? I alone can never understand this, but I can read
some of the minds that had spent life time searching the answer and to me that’s lots of fun.
Sometimes I wish I was born in 3000 or may be later, so I can see how much we human have increased our
knowledge and understanding of our own origins. I am sure we get closer to answering these questions, but
no one knows if we will answer all the questions!
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#3
Posted by Biblical Christian In Response to #1 and #2
(Answered by Skeptic One at #4)
Life is God’s gift. You are right that one of the most difficult questions is: Why is there something rather
than nothing at all? I have added still two difficult questions in my website at:
http://www.geocities.com/perianthium786/basic.html
No one can answer such question unless he or she must first assumed the truth of the Bible.
All questions have answers. All problems have solutions. All mysteries can be understood. All in the
Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ alone.
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#4
Posted by Skeptic One In Response to #3
There’s problem with the solution you suggested. Why would you ask someone to assume Bible as
fundamental truth. You can assume that Christians may listem to you. How can you say this to a Muslim
or Jewish person? Would you assume that Qur’an (Muslim religion book) or Tora (Jewish religion book)
are fundamental truth?
I hope you see my point and see the error in your logic.
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______________
#2 Joe the Skeptic can only hope for hopelessness by wishing to live in the future just to see how questions are being
answered at that time. For him, the attempt to answer a question is fun even though you cannot answer that question.
He lived in the exciting dream world of maximum uncertainty and insecurity. This is the world of all infidels when
reduced to its logical conclusion: anarchic insanity. Ultimately, no solution, no answer and no explanation in the
dream-world of infidels.
#3 When confronted with the Bible truth, this is always the reaction of all infidels: emotional panic. By blindly holding
to their cherished beliefs, without researching history, they assumed that all “religious” books are equal. I challenged
all infidels to name a religious book or any kind of books that can produce the modern science and technology, puritan
work ethic, computer science, Reformation period, capitalism, public education, government constitution, human
rights, hospitals and medical mission, charitable works, harmonious family relationship, peace and order in society,
hierarchical authority, freedom of expression in art, music and literatures, democratic freedoms, Lincoln-Luther anti-
slavery, male-female complementarism, sublime morality, anti-terrorism, monogamy, pro-life movement,
environmental science, advanced civilization, true spirituality, balanced perspectives and decision-making, ethical
absolutes, stewardship of property, linear history, Christian psychology, equal justice, home-church-state relation,
rules/laws/policies, etc. Do you know what is that amazing book? I’ll name it for you: the Holy Bible.
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#5
Posted by Biblical Christian In Response to #4
Even a muslim and a jew assumed the truth of the Bible; in fact, they believed that some of the books of the
Bible are given by God. To clear the smoke which created by my comments, I would further tell you that
I’m referring to subject-object correlation which can be found in the Judeo-christian system alone as
revealed in the Bible. Tell me if there is any system in the world which can explain why we need to answer
a question. The Bible alone reveals the reason, and to live in this world needs one to assume its truth. I see
your point but there is no error in my logic.
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#6
Just because other people believe in it, doesn’t make it true. You wrote “Tell me if there is any system in
the world which can explain why we need to answer a question.” I have no clue what are you trying to say!
I don’t need to believe in Bible in order to understand the truth in this world. I can understand the world
through Science and reason. I don’t have to read religious books to understand world around me, may be
you think you need to. I don’t agree with you. By the way what do you think about most of the posts here?
Do you agree or disagree with them?
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#7
(Answered by Atheist at #8 and #37)
You’re right, that a person’s belief will not make a thing to be true. In fact, I have wrote an article
regarding this fact last year in my website with the title SCIENTISM. But God reveals truth to all men and
thus it is also true that oftentimes, though not at all times, what people generally believed is true! You
cannot really understand the world if you will not believed to the truth of the Bible. Just by thinking and
writing correctly, you already assumed the truth of the Bible otherwise you will find yourself confined in
an asylum or jail. Even Science and reason which you claimed to be your means of understanding the
world are based on the Bible! Let me explain, there are three basic premises and reasonings of science of
science which were based on the Bible: 1. the world is real 2. our mind is reliable and can know the real
nature of the world and 3. the law of cause and effect. All these three can be found only in the Bible. This
has been admitted by modern scientists themselves, needless to say that almost all the primary developers
and founders of science were Bible believers. Science and reason need the Judeo-christian worldview as
revealed in the Bible to be truly workable and livable. You need not to agree with me in order to believed
in the Bible especially to its very circumference and center: the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ. You must
believed in Jesus alone! He is the answer to all our questions.
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______________
#6 Joe at this point had lost sight of the significance of what he is trying to say and not to what I’m trying to say. In his
response to Ryazanaban at #2, he pointed out the “fun” of answering questions. The root concept here is simply
communication. Man is created in God’s image. He was created to speak, communicate, relate, adapt, share, receive,
contribute, accept, give, enjoy, etc. He was designed to have a relationship. That includes answering a question. If
there is no Infinite-Personal Triune God, there is no point to answer a question. There is no meaning. In
atheist/polytheist/pantheist/panentheist/”monotheist” dream world, there is no significance to live at all in the
multiverses of chance and worthless configuration of gods against gods and/or atoms against atoms. If the Bible were
not true (i.e., if the infidels belief-systems are all true), there would be no law or order in the universe. All men will
become animals or insane and things will randomly become self-destructive. Joe the Skeptic had a sense of meaning
that is why he still lived otherwise he will destroy everything around him and ultimately he will commit suicide. He
lived inconsistently because he lived not in accordance to his belief-system but in accordance to the Bible truth.
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#8
Posted by Atheist In Response to #7 ~∞~
Obviously, you believe in the Bible and in Jesus Christ. Fine, I “… to find your true purpose
respect that. However, not everyone believes what you believe in for being on the earth, it begins
and that is also to be respected. with turning it over to God. He
-------------- - -------------------- will show you the most
#9
Posted by Biblical Christian In Response to #8 fulfilling life you can live, the
(Answered by Critic at #10 and by Atheist at #39) one that was designed for you.
We are dealing here with the question raised by Ryazanaban last But to find it, you have to give
Feb.4 about the meaning of life. True, beliefs other than the
Judeo-christian faith must be respected but they are not it up to him. Become his
respectable as revealed by their inconsistency and servant, and you will
unreasonableness. If you know that others believed are wrong
about it you must correct them. It is clear, from the series of
gain everything.”
– Henry Cloud, The Secret Things of God,
responses about this issue that Bible-rejecting individuals do not
New York: Howard Books, 2007, p. 143.
live consistently with their beliefs. Those who believed that this
world just came by chance live with the order established by ~∞~
Bible-believing community. Those who believed that they are just advanced animal live with the concept
that they were created in the image of God who can think and act in accordance with the principles and
laws created and governed by the Creator. Those who do not believed to the validity of the Decalogue (the
10 commandments) still live because they, together with others with them, follow the Decalogue. Those
who reject the truth of the Bible live because the author of the Bible made them to live. There is no escape.
Our mind, conscience, soul, spirit, body, this world, our fellow men, were created and maintained by God.
The Bible reveals truth before and since the foundation of this world and its end and even the creation of
the new heaven and new earth. There is no need for any other religious book pretending to be inspired by
God. All is completely revealed about the meaning of life. The Lord will judge the world according to the
light which they have seen as He revealed to them. The Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ is the ultimate and
complete revelation of God to man. He is the revelation of God Himself. He is the real meaning of life.
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#10
Posted by Critic In Response to #9
Is not!
Seriously, Periander, lecturing won’t get you very far on this board. Assertion is not argument.
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#11
(Answered by Critic at #12)
Assertion is an argument. You cannot have a meaningful conversation with someone if you have no belief
of anything for you cannot share anything. You must either a PRO or a CONTRA, no in-between (except,
perhaps, you are the moderator). There must be a point of agreement as basic premise to start a
conversation or an argument. Basic premises must never be contested, only its superstructures which have
been built by opposing parties. Truth always prevails. Jesus is the true truth.
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______________
#10 Chris started his assertion here by denial with exclamation and then inconsistently asserted that “Assertion is not
argument” while asserting that my “lecturing won’t get [me] very far on this board.” You know what? The asserted
“prophecy” of Chris the Critic failed miserably for I have the longest contribution in this forum. Before I joined the
forum, they are attacking one another but after I joined the forum they gather together as one to attack me. Those in
the darkness grouped themselves when light comes but they are all defeated and extinguished by the power of Light!!!
This alone proved the truth of Christianity and the falsity or error of infidels’ worldviews/belief-systems.
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#12
I’m not the moderator, just a guy who discovered this site last summer and is getting a great deal of
enjoyment out of it. I should have refrained from responding to your post, but I was amused by your style
and couldn’t resist a flip comment. I have argued in the past with people who have views that are (as far as
I can tell) identical to yours, and have learned as much as I think I can from such exchanges; so I don’t
think I’ll be trading posts with you. I certainly did not intend to try to stop you from posting, but rather
give you some friendly advice about you style. I did look at you website, and while I don’t share your
beliefs, I admire your energy and commitment.
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#13
(Answered by Atheist at #14)
If what you wrote recently was intended as a friendly advice, there’s nothing wrong with that. However, it
seems that you are trying to point my “style” which is nothing less than what I’ve learned from the Bible
especially in the Lord Jesus. He did not try to compromise His belief during His earthly life where there
were various existing belief-systems. He just tells the real issue as it is without any sign of worldly
influences. He tells the truth assertively in a clear and concise manner. Even the apostle Paul taught and
wrote what God had revealed to him without standing in any so-called neutral position. He live and die in
and for truth as he expressed in Phil.1:21 “For to me to live is Christ, and to die is gain.” This is not an
expression of bigoted dogmatism but of pure love and total surrender for and to the truth. “For we can do
nothing against the truth, but for the truth” (2 Cor 13:8). Jesus is the true truth (Jn.14:6).
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#14
Posted by Atheist In Response to #13
(Answered by Christian One at #15 and by Biblical Christian at #17)
According to the New Testament, Jesus Christ lived 33 years on Earth, only the last three were sketchily
documented focusing only on his ministry. What happened from the time he was 12 years old and the age
30? If your Bible is so complete, surely the most important and influential figure in all of history would be
documented with a little more detail. He was so unsure about his convictions: his 30 days in the desert
tempted by the Satan, and right up to the moment at the Garden of Getsemene and the apostles were
sleeping when he asked that this “chalis be taken away” from him. I hate to ask you to answer these
questions because you have totally surrendered any desire to question. This is according to conventions
used called “blind faith”, which is good for some, but here on this site most of us question everything with
an honest desire to find answers based on reason and facts, not unproveable quotes from the Bible.
Actually, in a way, your faith is admirable.
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______________
#14 As you can clearly see, only the Judeo-christian faith is reasonable and based on objective evidences. All other
religions and belief-systems are based on blind faith, emotion and subjectivity. Look for example the Yogic system of
the East which is purely based on dream, delusion and demonic/diabolical possession. Even atheism is based on
emotion as Isaac Asimov admitted: “I am an atheist, out and out. It took me a long time to say it. I’ve been an atheist
for years and years, but somehow I felt it was intellectually unrespectable to say one was an atheist, because it
assumed knowledge that one didn’t have. Somehow it was better to say one was a humanist or an agnostic. I finally
decided that I’m a creature of emotion as well as of reason. Emotionally I am an atheist. I don’t have the evidence to
prove that God doesn’t exist, but I so strongly suspect he doesn’t that I don’t want to waste my time.” (Isaac Asimov in
Paul Kurtz, ed., “An Interview with Isaac Asimov on Science and the Bible,” Free Inquiry 2, Spring, 1982, p.9). This is
a shocking truth: Rejecting objective Judeo-christianity absolutely means accepting subjective insanity.
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#15 ~∞~
Posted by Christian One In Response to #14 “Amid this all too familiar
(Answered by Atheist at #16 and by Biblical Christian at #17)
I’ve been missing most of the posts for the last few weeks, but emptiness and uncertainty,
I saw this one and was interested. Jesus Christ invites us to
Louis, you ask why, if the bible is complete, does it not have
an account of Jesus as a child? Well, what do you mean by accompany Him on an
complete. As far as I know, the Gospels were written to show incredible journey toward a
that Jesus was the Christ. That was their purpose. In order to meaningful life, a secured
do that, they had to include some history, like the resurrection,
etc, but their goal (even Luke’s account—though a historian) future, and the power to
was to tell about Jesus and his claim to Kingship. Their goal significantly impact the
was not to give a historical, minute by minute, whole account
of the life of Jesus, or Moses, or Elija, or whoever you want to
world around us.”
– Joseph M. Stowell, Following Christ:
pick. The bible, though a history, is not written for history
Experiencing Life the Way It Was
purposes. It is written for others to come to a belief in Christ. Meant to Be, Grand Rapids: Zondervan
So to say that the ‘bible isn’t complete’ isn’t really saying Publishing House, 1996, p. 31.
much. Once again, what do you mean by complete? In a ~∞~
spiritual sense, it is. In a scientific sense, or historical sense,
or mathematical sense, on and on and on… it is not. Was never meant to be.
Hope this clears things up.
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#16
(Answered by Biblical Christian at #17 and by Critic at #22)
Glad you’re back.
If “the Gospels were written to show that Jesus was the Christ”, what’s been claimed to be (by believers)
the single greatest human/god event in history, one, the way it was documented does not prove anything
beyond a reasonable doubt, and two, there are too many databits missing to satisfy the future generations
who might wish to know more since they were not actual witnesses.
The response that the Bible is not a history book or “minute by minute, whole account of the life of Jesus”
leaves a lot to desire since there is no actual biography of Jesus. Even Moses had a much longer account of
his life, but Moses was not the “son of God”. I mean listen to what you’re saying, Moses who was not as
transcendental gets more coverage than Jesus, the son of God. Is it me or is there something seriously
lacking? Even taking into consideration the improvements in literature, language and style developed
during 1250 years between Moses and Jesus, where even stone was replaced by parchments by Jesus’ time,
you’d expect much more information being documented. Not so.
These are valid arguments on the “Greatest Story Ever Told” and too much is left to faith, ambiguity,
heresay, etc. I’m open to reason if I get good answers.
Another question I’d like a clear explanation for is, according to Isaiah, the Messiah would be named
“Emmanuel” which doesn’t even sound like Jesus phonetically.
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______________
#15 Louis the Atheist did not know that Josh the Christian One is the famous evidential apologist. He is Josh
McDowell, the author of over twenty-five popular books on Christian apologetics such as Evidence That Demands A
Verdict (Two Volumes), Answers To Tough Questions, Handbook of Today’s Religions, His Image…My Image, the
Secret of Loving, the Resurrection Factor, and He Walked Among Us. In the Volume One of his best-selling book
Evidence That Demands A Verdict, he thoroughly documented with good solid evidences the following: Uniqueness,
Indestructibility and Reliability of the Bible, the Historicity and Deity of Jesus, Fulfilled Messianic Prophecies, Positive
Evidences for Resurrection, Fulfilled Prophecy in History, the Uniqueness of the Christian Experience, and the
Personal Testimony of Josh McDowell himself.
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#17
Posted by Biblical Christian In Response to #14, #15 and #16
(Answered by Skeptic Two at #18)
Josh is right that the Bible is complete not in the sense which you try to push in the Bible’s completeness.
When I said that the Bible is complete, it is complete in all what we need to give us the message of God (2
Tim.3:16-17; 2 Pet.1:3), thus, as I have said, there is no need for any other religious book pretending to be
inspired by God. There’s no need for any actual biography of the Lord Jesus for His preexistence (as God),
His birth (as man), His death (as servant), and His resurrected life (as King) will not be possible to put into
any sort of “biography” in complete fashion for His very existence has no beginning and ending. Even just
His earthly life as John the beloved pointed out will never be possible to put in any books, beside the fact
that no one can ever read them all if they are written in part. What is written is complete for man to believe
that He is indeed the Messiah, the only Lord and Saviour of mankind. Thus, if one will not believe in Him
is not due to fact that the evidence is insufficient but that those men don’t really want to believe no matter
how true the evidences are. The question that you must answer is: Why is it that even though Jesus didn’t
wrote any book, and those who knew Him wrote only in detail His last three years on earth, yet He caused
many pens to write in praise of Him until today and His impact in history is unsurpassed by those famous
men who wrote voluminous books and whose autobiography and biography were put in great detail?
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#18
Posted by Skeptic Two In Response to #17
It is disappointing to read people talking past each other. (sigh) L
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#19
Due to the nature of my job as science instructor in a place where there is no available internet, I cannot
always respond everyday, usually I give my responses every weekend. But I always try to make a reply for
this is the duty of every Christian “to give an answer to every man that asketh you a reason of the hope that
is in you” (1 Pet.3:15). The question of the meaning of life can only be adequately answered by the Judeo-
christian system alone as revealed in the Bible.
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#20
I wouldn’t want a science teacher like you to teach me science. I expect science teacher to be open minded.
At least as a science teacher you should believe in your own subject. What do you teach you kids, that
science is lot of hocus focus??
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_____________
#19 This situation was true eight years ago but now Internet is available everywhere. Wireless technology did it. Do
you know that T.V., radio, computers, cellular phones, Internet, wireless technology, etc. were already prophesied in
the Bible? Read and analyze very carefully Daniel 12:4 and Revelation 11:9-11. In fact, most of the founders and
primary developers of modern science are Bible-believing Christians such as Isaac Newton, Blaise Pascal, Robert
Boyle, Charles Babbage, etc. And most of the Nobel laureates are Jews who believed in the God of the Bible. Jews,
both believers and unbelievers, are history maker and world shaker: Albert Einstein, Karl Marx, Sigmund Freud,
Houdini, Steven Spielberg, Charlie Chaplin, Larry King, etc. Most of the giant businesses in the world, specifically in
U.S.A. and Europe, are owned by Jews. Thousands of modern scientists today are Bible-believing Christians who are
members of Institute for Creation Research (ICR), Creation Research Society (CRS) and Discovery Institute. Visit
also http://nobelists.net
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#21
Posted by Biblical Christian In Response to #20 ~∞~
(No one answered) “Although our own pain is not
If your definition of scientific open-mindedness is that I must be
convinced of your belief, you’re definitely close-minded. For a always the result of our
long time, I’ve waited for your response but now you appear again personal sin, sin, in a larger
out of the blue, I am not offering myself to teach you, you need not sense, is the reason pain and
like me in order to learn science, for science by modern definition
is a systematized body of knowledge based on facts which must be disease entered Eden. Sin
observable, repeatable and demonstrable. Just by mere entered the world and altered it
conversation like this will not bring you to scientific learning, you
must experience it. The same with the truth of the Bible, you are
so completely that struggle
rejecting it without ever studying it for yourself even though you became a part of man’s
assumed it throughout your life. True science, as I have already everyday existence (see Gen.3).
pointed out to you, always assumed Bible truth to be truly
workable and livable. You cannot do any scientific investigation, From Genesis 3 on, the Bible’s
you cannot learn any science, if you assumed that the universe is central message is redemption.
full of chaos without order, that the world is not real (just illusion It is about how God chose not
or “maya”), that your mind is not reliable (just an evolved ape-
mind), that there is no cause and effect, that the universe is not to wipe us out. It is the story
unified, that there are no laws which governed this world and your of how a holy God who cannot
mind, that … ad infinitum. You must have an open mind to
consider the truth of the whole Bible which you already assumed,
tolerate sin made a way
study it thoroughly, pray to God so that you can understand it for us to be sinless.”
through the guidance of the Holy Spirit. As the saying goes, “An – Robin Prince Monroe, Loss of a Dream,
open Bible needs an open heart and mind.” Jesus is the true truth. Makati City: Church Strengthening
Ministry, 1994, pp. 10 -11.
-------------- - ---------------------
~∞~
#22
The figure of Moses collected a lot of explanatory “back story” as the early Jewish scriptures developed.
That relatively few legends (the virgin birth, the trip to Bethlehem, a few other) about his birth and youth
were added to the Gospels shows the emphasis that his early believers placed on his preaching and
crucifixion. I don’t know that the lack of information provided about his early adulthood makes it any less
believable that he was the son of God. There are stories about the Buddha’s childhood, and even many of
his past lives, but that does not make me any more inclined to believe that he was more than a man.
-------------- - --------------------------------------
#23
(Answered by Critic at #24)
You’re not saying, that Christ was the son of God, are you?
______________
#21 There is an inseparable connection between the Bible and modern science. This indisputable fact had been clearly
shown by many scientists and philosophers/historians of science. Read the following to see that Judeo-Christian
worldview made possible the birth of modern science: S. Jaki, Science and Creation; L. Gilkey, Maker of Heaven and
Earth; A. Whitehead, Science and Modern World; Oppenheimer, On Science and Culture; Foster, The Christian
Doctrine of Creation and the Rise of Modern Natural Science; E. Klaaren, Religious Origins of Modern Science; M.
Calvin, Chemical Evolution; R. Hooykaas, Religion and the Rise of Modern Science; L.Eiseley, Darwin’s Century:
Evolution and the Men Who Discovered It; C. von Weizsacker, The Relevance of Physics; Hodgson, Book Review of
Jaki’s Science and Creation; W. Glover, Biblical Origins of Modern Secular Culture; F. Oakley, Natural Law,
Conciliarism and Consent in the Late Middle Ages; and E. Mach, Science and Mechanics. No other belief-systems or
worldviews can give rise or originate the Modern Science, only the Bible truth.
11
#24
No, what I’m saying is that the lack of information in the Gospels about Jesus in his twenties has no
bearing whether we should believe them. I still think that Jesus was a man who attracted a good many
followers, some of whom were even more remarkable and persuasive than he was (they were better
managers too!). That the message of Christianity was and still is powerful is indisputable indeed, but
whether it is true is not.
------------- - --------------------------------------
#25
(Answered by Mystic at #26)
The Bible is complete, there’s no need for any other additional information to “complete” its message.
You’re right that it is indisputable that the message of Christianity was and is powerful, it is due to the fact
that it really gives meaning to life, it is true to the total reality. No system in this world about ultimate
concern can adequately explain the entire reality (universal, biological, and social) except the Judeo-
christian system.
------------- - --------------------------------------
- #26
Posted by Mystic In Response to #25
ARE YOU SURE ABOUT THAT? TALK TO A METAPHIST.
-------------- - --------------------------------------
#27
I need not to talk to your “metaphist” to be sure that I am sure to what I am sure. The only real
METAPHIST Whom I know Who know the entire reality, Who know all the facts, because He is the
Creator and Sustainer of the total reality is God Himself who wrote the Bible to reveal Himself for us. But
those who do not believe in God based their certainty upon their imperfect mind who know facts but an iota
part of the total reality, and even this they are not sure that they are sure.
-------------- - --------------------------------------
______________
#22 and #23 Chris the Critic proved beyond a reasonable shadow of a doubt that close-mindedness is a great
hindrance in believing the whole Bible no matter how solid and how many the evidences are! No amount of evidence
can convinced an infidel whose blind faith to infidelity ruined his ability to think logically, scientifically, properly and
correctly. Let all infidels reduced their belief-system into its logical conclusion. What will happen if the Bible is not
true (skepticism), if the infinite-personal, rational God did not create, sustain and redeem this world (evolutionism), if
there is no right or wrong, good or evil (mysticism), if the ultimate reality is matter (materialism), if all things in this
world are just illusion (spiritualism), if all things were controlled by impersonal gods/demons/spirits
(polytheism/spiritism/pantheism), if revolution, terrorism is the key toward peace (communism, anarchism,
mohammedanism), if all superstitious beliefs are true (paganism), if the universe is ultimately governed by mindless
chance (scientism), if all men are gods who are all self-sufficient (new ageism), if the number one rule is that there are
no rules but pure subjectivity (postmodernism), if life is just a game or love does not exists (hedonism), if all belief-
system is true no matter how absurd or contradictory it is (religionism), ad infinitum absurdum..? Do you know what
will happen? If all these Bible-rejecting belief systems are true, you will have no time to answer these questions at all
for there will be no you who are going to answer these questions. In a nanosecond, you may be converted into an
amoeba or dog (chance or gods did it! - pessimism). Your husband, wife, close friend, son, daughter, neighbour, or
fellow men may instantly kill you and you may insanely kill yourself (life is meaningless, isn’t it? - nihilism). In the
dream world of infidels, you have no right to live and you have no reason to exist at all!
12
#28 ~∞~
Posted by Mystic In Response to #27 “…the Bible gives a unity to the universal
in case you were not are of this, GOD DID and the particulars. First, the Bible tells
NOT WRITE THE BIBLE! PEOPLE DID! men and women true things about God.
now with that said lets move onto something
else. what makes you think god is male? how Therefore, they can know true things about
do you know this whole thing is not run by God. One can know true things about God
some omnipotent chick? you dont. dont even because God has revealed Himself. The word
give some defense like “the bible says ‘lord’,
‘he’ and other other such male indicating God was not contentless to Reformation
words”. the bible was written in times where man. God was not an unknown ‘philosophic
women were considered property, men ran
everything, and god only talked to men. hmm.
other’ because God had told man about
i wonder why god is said to be a man. dont Himself. …That is, when God tells people
pull “god created MAN in his image” either. what He is like, what He says is not just
isnt mankind used to indicate the whole
species? and what makes you think it ment our
relatively true but absolutely true. As finite
physical bodies? do really think god’s true beings, people do not have exhaustive truth
form is even anything we would be able to about God, but they can have truth about
comprehend? and you also say “imperfect
minds”. whats with that? if god is perfect, how God; and they can know, therefore, truth
can we not be if we are made in gods image? about that which is the ultimate universal.
If we are imperfect, that kills any idea of god And the Bible speaks to men and women
being perfect either. how can that which is
perfect create any thing that is imperfect? you concerning meaning, morals, and values.
dont know do you? your not SURE, are you? Second, the Bible tells us true things about
never thought about that, huh? if we are
imperfect, god cant be that perfect if it
people and about nature. It does not give
screwed up. Think about all this before you men and women exhaustive truth about the
reply next. world and the cosmos, but it does give truth
-------------- - ---------- about them. So one can know many true
______________
#28 All the objections given in this forum by things about nature, especially why things
skeptics, critics, atheists, mystics, new agers, and exist and why they have the form they have.
infidels were already answered with great detail at
www.christian-thinktank.com and in the following Yet, because the Bible does not give
books: Dr. Peter S. Ruckman’s Problem Texts, exhaustive truth about history and the
Pensacola: Pensacola Bible Institute Press, 1980,
499 pp. Dr. Gerardus D. Bouw’s The Book of Bible cosmos, historians and scientists have a job
Problems, Cleveland: Association for Biblical to do, and their work is not meaningless. To
Astronomy, 1997, 265 pp. Dr. Norman Geisler’s
When Critics Ask, Victor Books, 1992, 604 pp. be sure, there is a total break between God
These proved that all infidels’ objections were just and His creation, that is, between God and
results of their laziness to properly and prayerfully
study the Bible that’s why they have so many created things; God is infinite -- and created
misinterpretations and misconceptions of the Bible. things are finite. But man can know both
All their so-called errors and contradictions in the
Bible merely exposed their perversions of God’s truth about God and truth about the things
Word as the Lord told the infidels during his of creation because in the Bible God has
earthly life: “Ye do err, not knowing the scriptures,
nor the power of God” (Matthew 22:29). Twist the revealed Himself and has given man the key
Mystic is ignorant of the fact that the Bible alone to understanding God’s world.”
really gives honor to woman since the ancient time
– Francis A. Schaeffer, “How Should We Then Live?” in
until this day. And that the original creation was
perfect but sin entered because of one man (not of The Complete Works of Francis A. Schaeffer: A Christian
woman). All are sinners who need the only Lord Worldview, Vol. 5, Westchester: Crossway Books,
and Saviour, the Son of God, made of a woman. 1982, pp. 123-124.
~∞~
13
#29
What you have said are all beside the point. Obviously, God did not write literally the Bible, you need not
to talk about it in a six years old boy or girl, people of course wrote it, dogs can’t write, ape can’t write,
worm can’t write, people of God wrote it for all men as directed by the Holy Spirit. If your definition of
writing is what in your autonomous mind, then you did not write also what you “wrote” in this forum.
COMPUTER DID IT! What flow of logic do you follow when you “said” that “if god is perfect, how can
we not be if we are made in gods (sic) image? If we are imperfect, that kills any idea of god being perfect
either. how can that which is perfect create any thing that is imperfect?” Again, I congratulate you that,
like your fellow infidels, atheists, skeptics, critics, mystics, etc., thoroughly refuted your OWN idea of God,
you disprove, at last, your wrong concept of God, you once-and-for-all demolished your perverted
knowledge of God! The God of gods, Lord of lords, and King of kings who WROTE the Book of books is
perfect. Only the imperfect mind of man who wants to understand Him by himself makes Him imperfect.
Jesus is the true truth.
-------------- - --------------------------------------
#30
do us all a favor and reread what you just wrote. keep doing that until you realize how dumb that last part
sounded. oh, one more thing. when you quoted me? you filtered it. you did not quote me exactly. my point
has been proven. thank you very much. and we are back at square one. you are avoiding the perfection
subject. you have no way out of that one do ya? Matt 7:1
-------------- - --------------------------------------
#31
You proved nothing but your ignorance of the Bible. Read and understand what you write and my response
100 times (if you want a googol times, much better). You disproved nothing but your OWN TWISTED
concept of God and the Bible. Thanks for refuting yourself (i.e., your personal experience). Jesus is the
true truth.
-------------- - --------------------------------------
#32
how can one disprove experience? are you going to prove that it didn’t happen? i would like to see you try
-------------- - --------------------------------------
#33
You disprove your own belief which you claimed to have been based upon your personal experience by
your own inconsistency. Your experience deceived you to the point that you cannot see that you have been
deceived. You assumed Bible truth in order to live but you hold it in unrighteousness by the way you live
(Rom.1:18-23).
-------------- - --------------------------------------
______________
#30 The final court of appeal of all New Agers, mystics or yogis is actual/direct experience. But we cannot experience
all that we know. How do you know that there are atoms, Antarctica, planets, other minds, values, etc.? How do you
know that one plus one is equal to two (1 + 1 = 2)? That illegal drug is dangerous? That poison/virus can kill you?
That no one can survive in beheading? Can you experience all of these in order to know that they are true and real?
Yogic belief is clearly absurd!!!
14
#34 ~∞~
Posted by Mystic In Response to #33 “In other words, in every
what is this bible truth of which you keep speaking? forget discipline, the Christian
about being guilty, we are innocent instead. two seemingly worldview shines brighter than
contodictory truths can exist at the same time. reread my
statements, there are no contradictions. its competition, is more
-------------- - ---------------- realistic, better explains man
#35 and the universe, is true to the
Posted by Biblical Christian In Response to #34 Bible, is more scientific, is more
You said that “two seemingly contodictory truths can exist at intellectually satisfying and
the same time. reread my statements, there are no defensible, and best of all, is in
contradictions” (I just copy what you wrote including typos), keeping with and faithful to
then why keep contradicting all what I have said to you about
the truth? Your response is self-defeating. You really the one person who has had the
contradicted your personal experiences by your expressed greatest influence in heaven
beliefs, opinions and ideas. Be true to yourself. Jesus is the
true truth.
and on earth – Jesus Christ.”
– David A. Noebel, Understanding the
-------------- - ------------------ Times: The Religious Worldviews of Our
#36 Day and the Search for Truth, Eugene:
Posted by Mystic In Response to #35 Harvest House Publishers, 1991, p. 800.
(Answered by Biblical Christian at #97) ~∞~
how am i contradicting my experiences? you don’t know what
my experiences are, so how would you know if i am or not? we are not contradicting at all. think. what you
are saying is truth and what i am are basically the same thing. i am true to myself, but one must define what
one is not before one can define what one is. how will you know you are being true to yourself if you are
limited in your experience of yourself? maybe who you think you are is not who you are. we are all love,
but how can you know that unless you have experienced that which is not love? i have not contradicted my
self in any way.
-------------- - --------------------------------------
#37
Excuse me but, there were humans around long before the Bible was ever written and, I’m very sure they
knew that the “1. the world is real 2. our mind is reliable and can know the real nature of the world and 3.
the law of cause and effect.
I can’t believe that you can say that, “These can only be found in the Bible”. You limit humans to idiots by
that comment.
-------------- - --------------------------------------
______________
#36 and #37 Twist/Adam the Mystic and Louis the Atheist ignorantly agreed here that you could live in reality and
know the truth without the Judeo-christian system. They are absolutely wrong. Open your mind and see. John Cage
firmly believed in the chaotic/irrationality of nature which he applied in his chance music. But, as a mycologist, he
could not applied that philosophy because he rationally and non-randomly discriminate between safe and poisonous
mushrooms. Bernard Berenson lived hedonistically because he firmly believed that man is just an animal which must
follow his sexual urge wherever it leads. But he cannot applied this belief-system to his true passion, to what he truly
valued -- the Renaissance art, because he was horrified and greatly dismayed by the “bestiality” of modern art. All
unbelievers simply cannot live consistently with his belief-system. The famous existentialist atheist Jean-Paul Sartre
admitted toward the end of his life: “I do not feel that I am the product of chance, a speck of dust in the universe, but
someone who was expected, prepared, prefigured. In short, a being whom only a Creator could put here; and this idea
of a creating hand refers to God.” (National Review, NY, 11 June 1982, p. 677, article by Thomas Molnar – Professor
of French and World Literature at Brooklyn College). In recent time, the world-renowned atheist Antony Flew now
believed in God because of the cumulative evidences given to him by Gary Habermas and by Intelligent Design
Movement. How much more is the inconsistency of all New Agers, mystics and yogis with their belief-system?
15
#38
(No one answered)
The validity of your statement depends upon your knowledge of the Bible. I am not limiting humans to
idiots by my comments that the three basic premises upon which the modern science was founded can only
be found in the Bible. For the Bible is a collection of books which were written starting from the creation
of the world where there are no humans except Adam and Eve (this can be proved scientifically through
archeology) up to the time of the apostles but transcending our present time for John the Beloved wrote the
book of the Revelation after he saw the new heaven and new earth of the future (this can be explained
scientifically through RELATIVITY). You’ve also missed my point, true, people knew the three basic
assumptions of science even though they didn’t know the Bible but it is just a further confirmation of Bible
truth (Rom.1:19,20) that they were created in the image of God and that God reveals Himself to them
through the witness of nature (general revelation) thus they knew that the world is real and they can know
its real nature. My point is, how can people knew these assumptions if there’s no one who put it in the first
place in them. If the world just came by chance and we are just “little higher than the apes” (cp. Heb.2:7)
as the Bible-rejecting “intellectuals” would like us to believe, then why does people keep proving through
their lives in the order of this cosmos that these pseudo-intellectuals were wrong and the Bible is right?
-------------- - --------------------------------------
#39
I too believe and practice the last seven of the ten commandments. I also choose to live in relative
judeo/Christian values in which “love thy neighbor” is the most important. However, you state that, “If you
know what is true about the meaning of life you must share it to others but if you know that others believed
are wrong about it you must correct them.” This is the same thinking that inspired: the crusades that lasted
hundreds of years, the inquisition of heretics and later persecution of protestants during the late middle ages
up until the 1800s; the conquistadors that brought Christianity to America and decimated the native cultures
that inhabited the Americas for thousands of years before Europeans arrived; the nazi directed holocast and
genocide of the jews, the ethnic cleansing taking place in the Balkan republics and former Soviet republics.
I believe that the belief in God and religious institutions can be good for humanity, but, it is not good for
humanity when one religion (whichever one) forces its beliefs on people who believe differently.
Periander, be careful not to continue the practice of religious intolerance of which the world has seen too
much throughout the recorded history.
-------------- - --------------------------------------
______________
#38 You see this is the second instance when no one can answer my post, the first is #21. This merely proved that no
one is able to answer my post when it deals with the very meaning of reality and essence of humanity. Only in the
sphere of Judeo-Christianity where reality and humanity can co-exist in peaceful consistency. The undeniable fact of
the universe and the heart of man will indeed shut you up to let you contemplate within the circle of the Bible truth.
Unless you believed Jesus Christ as your personal Lord and Saviour, you will never know reality as it is and you
cannot live consistently designed for all of us by God Himself as Dr. Herman Dooyeweerd pointed out:
“Since the fall and the promise of the coming Redeemer, there are two central main springs operative in the heart of
human existence. The first is the dynamis of the Holy Ghost, which by the moving power of God's Word, incarnated in
Jesus Christ, re-directs to its Creator the creation that had apostatized in the fall from its true Origin. This dynamis
brings man into the relationship of sonship to the Divine Father. Its religious ground-motive is that of the Divine Word-
Revelation, which is the key to the understanding of Holy Scripture: the motive of creation, fall, and redemption by
Jesus Christ in the communion of the Holy Ghost. The second central main spring is that of the spirit of apostasy from
the true God. As religious dynamis (power), it leads the human heart in an apostate direction, and is the source of all
deification of the creature. It is the source of all absolutizing of the relative even in the theoretical attitude of thought.
By virtue of its idolatrous character, its religious ground-motive can receive very diverse contents.”
(Herman Dooyeweerd, A New Critique of Theoretical Thought, 4 Volumes, Ontario: Paideia Press Ltd., Vol. I, p.61)
16
#40
Posted by Biblical Christian In Response to #39 ~∞~
You have admitted that you believe and practice the truth “The natural man may
revealed in the Bible for this is the only way for man to live disbelieve, and the worldly man
meaningfully in this world. What I have learned from the Bible may scorn, when we preach the
will not caused me to repeat the lessons of religious history. If
you really love you neighbour as yourself, do you think your love Gospel doctrine of salvation
will cause you to kill others just to force your belief to them? through the substitutionary
Except you believed that such commandment is absolute, you too work of Jesus on the Cross; but
will try to pervert it so as to give license of killing others who
will not be convinced to believe what you believed. In the Bible we who know Him have proved
you will find the crescendo of highest morality. In the Old that only there is real solution
Testament you learned the ten commandments, it was further
given intimate meaning in the New Testament. For instance,
and salvation to be found.”
– J. Sidlow Baxter, “Christ Everything to
adultery was considered to be sin in actual commotion, but in
Us,” in Awake My Heart, Grand Rapids:
N.T. it was redefined, or more precisely, revealed as sin Daybreak Books, 1960, pp. 61.
occurring first of all within the person’s mind, so is murder,
idolatry, stealing, etc. The question naturally arises, do you think
~∞~
that what you have enumerated of killing incidences in religious history demonstrated the laws of love in
the Bible? They have never learned the truth of God is love. Let the Lord judge at the end those who will
not believed in Him.
-------------- - --------------------------------------
#41
No, I practice what I believe is good whether it is found in the Bible or I read it in the newspaper. The
Bible contains a lot of wisdom, but not all of it is love and peace. There are many stories of God leading
his chosen people in war against their neighbors..neighbors hwo lived and owned the land they lived on.
The Israelites invaded and killed them to take the land. That’s stealing! Under God’s law the Israelites
should have been killed themselves.
I do not justify those incidences in the Bible and I feel in my judgment to hold to a higher standard of
morality where killing under any circumstance is wrong. Stealing is wrong, adultery is wrong, saying false
things about someone is wrong. The Bible mentions slavery: the jews took and kept slaves, they became
slaves themselves various times. Slavery is wrong…yet under the guise of God’s will it is Good?
Periander, read the Bible and pass judgment on the examples it sets. What’s wrong is wrong! Don’t just
accept the Bible as being 100% good, there’s a lot of wrong in those pages along with goodness. You and
everyone must decide what’s good and what’s bad, not swallow the whole Book under one assumption.
______________
#41 Louis the Atheist foolishly thought that to claim the Promised Land owned by the Creator Himself is stealing. Does
this infidel know that Canaanites are an abomination to the Lord (Lev.18) and that the wages of sin is death? Does this
infidel know the meaning of the Hebrew word “nephilim” in the Bible? God can take life according to His perfect
will because He is sovereign over life (Deut.32:39; Job 1:21). According to this infidel “killing under any
circumstance is wrong” but the question that must be answered by this ignorant infidel are: “what is
killing?” Is killing plants, animals, insects also wrong? Is killing of criminals by the government also
wrong? Is killing bacteria, virus or pest also wrong? Who defined killing that is wrong? According to
what standard? Some infidels are vegetarian because they thought killing animals is wrong. But they
tolerate abortion/infanticide which is killing fetus/babies. They tolerate euthanasia/mercy-killing which is
killing the senescent and the hopeless. Abortion and euthanasia are obviously wrong. Do you now see the
arrogant stupidity of infidels? Lincoln and Luther overthrew slavery because of the application of the Bible
truth. All men are equally created with freedom and dignity in the image of God. Slavery are common in
ancient time but the O.T. demanded that all slaves will eventually be set free (Exod.21:2; Lev.25:40). The
N.T. tells us that in biblical Christianity “There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free,
there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus” (Gal.3:28).
17
#42
(Answered by Mystic at #43 and by Atheist #52)
If you used your own opinion to correct other opinions so as to say whether it is wrong or not will bring
you nowhere. To use not the Bible as your absolute basis of right and wrong is to find yourself in the
shoreless ocean of ideas and opinions. How do you know that one thing is wrong and the other is right, do
you make god out of yourself? What is your basis to say that killing, stealing, saying false thing about
someone are all wrong? Again, with that saying you assumed Bible truth but with the same breath you
reject it which is an expression of inconsistency. You must thoroughly study the Bible before you judge
some of its part to be not “good”. Have you already studied its detail so as not to miss those points which
are necessary to understand its meaning as a whole, or your rough-and-ready answers and judgments were
produce by your prejudice against it?
------------- - --------------------------------------
#43
Matt. 7:1, check it out.how do you figure the bible is complete? i guess you never found all the loop holes
and ways out that it has, such as genesis 4:1. and what is so “wrong” about proclaiming yourself to be god?
im god. every thing is. every nothing is. god is magnificent. so am i. so are you. where’s the problem? what
is “right” and what is “wrong”? is not wrong the opposite of that which is right? and what, or who, defines
either of these? if god thought some things were “wrong”, why did god create them? so he could punish us?
THAT makes a lot of sense. isaiah 45:7. read that too. have a nice day!
-------------- - --------------------------------------
______________
#43 I have clearly explained Matt.7:1 and Isaiah 45:7 at #83. As to Genesis 4:1, Gnostics have their own perverted
interpretation of this passage that’s why they thought the Bible has loopholes but there is no loophole whatsoever in
the Bible. Loopholes exist only in the perverted minds of infidels, eastern mystics, western New Agers, pagans,
agnostics, and Gnostics.
A blind man cannot see the beauty of a flower. A deaf man cannot hear the melody of a love song. A kindergarten
cannot understand a calculus book. A psychotic/schizophrenic or paranoid cannot learn the complexity of a computer
program. How much more is the beauty, melody, calculus, and complexity of the Bible can be known by finite, limited,
sinful man unless God Himself through the Holy Spirit illuminated and enlightened him?
Infidels lived in a dream world which they thought is reality itself. They lived in their invented delusion. Unless men
adapts God’s interpretation of reality, they will continually pervert and distort reality in accordance to their depravity
and deception.
“As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one: There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after
God. They are all gone out of the way, they are together become unprofitable; there is none that doeth good, no, not
one. Their throat is an open sepulchre; with their tongues they have used deceit; the poison of asps is under their lips:
Whose mouth is full of cursing and bitterness: Their feet are swift to shed blood: Destruction and misery are in their
ways: And the way of peace have they not known: There is no fear of God before their eyes. Now we know that what
things soever the law saith, it saith to them who are under the law: that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world
may become guilty before God.” (Rom.3:10-19)
18
#44 ~∞~
Posted by Biblical Christian In Response to #43 “One cannot trust in his
You stated: “what is so ‘wrong’ about proclaiming yourself to be church membership, his
god? im god. every thing is. every nothing is.” There’s no “wrong” baptism, or his good works
with that if you will asked those deluded fool who pretend to be god,
there’s no “wrong” with that if you will asked the old serpent, the to save him. One must
deceiver, Satan, devil, who pioneered such usurpation, there’s no simply trust in the Lord
“wrong” with that if you asked those who have a wrong mind like Jesus Christ alone by
you. I hope this is clear. God loves you that He gave His only
begotten Son to die and rise again for you, to save you from sin and believing on Him.”
death, don’t waste your time in defending and justifying your sins, – Douglas D. Stauffer, One Book
confess them to God and accept Jesus Christ as your personal Lord Stands Alone, Millbrook: McCowen
and Saviour. (Jn.3:16, Ac.16:31, Rom.10) Mills Publishers, 2001, p. 58.
-------------- - --------------- ~∞~
#45
MATT 7:1 ISAIAH 45:7 that’s all i have to say.
-------------- - --------------------------------------
#46
You say nothing. You are quoting the Bible out of its context. Remember the often-quoted fact: “a text
without a context is a pretext for a prooftext!” Again, you just unknowingly expressed your ignorance of
the Bible. Jesus is the true truth.
-------------- - --------------------------------------
#47
who are you to say what the bibles context is? why dont you stop picking the parts of what you believe in if
it is so ultimately true?
-------------- - --------------------------------------
#48
Where do you get your “idea” that if the Bible is ultimately true, then you can pick any part of it out of its
context? Absurdity. If you take any words of the Bible without considering its context, then you can prove
anything from the Bible: atheism – “there is no God” (Psa.14:1); hedonism – “A feast is made for laughter,
and wine maketh merry: but money answereth all things” (Ecc.10:19); irrationalism – “take no thought
beforehand what ye shall speak, neither do ye premeditate” (Mk.13:11); suicide – “to die is gain”
(Phil.1:21); pessimism – “And judgment is turned away backward, and justice standeth afar off: for truth is
fallen in the street, and equity cannot enter. Yea, truth faileth; and he that departeth from evil maketh
himself a prey” (Isa.59:14,15); New Ageism – “Christ in you” (Col.1:27); “honour the God of forces”
(Dan.11:38); “Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and the Spirit of God dwelleth in you?”
(1Cor.3:16); “Ye are gods” (Jn.10:34); Satanism – “And the devil said unto him, All this power will I give
thee, and the glory of them: for that is delivered unto me; and to whosoever I will give it. If thou therefore
wilt worship me, all shall be thine” (Lk.4:6,7); etc. etc. Prima facie, your own ignorance of the Bible will
bring you to hell. You must study a text of the Scripture in its context not only grammatically and
historically, but also, the most important, prayerfully. There’s no need to teach any literate person with a
sane mind to understand a text in its context, but I need to reiterate this to you for not only you are
Biblically illiterate but also spiritually blind, you need the Light Who alone can give you sight, He is the
Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ. This is the true and real enlightenment needed by humanity.
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#49
you are no more an authority to say what the bibles context is than i am, so drop this context crap. do really
believe that god can save you but not dwell in you? if we are all a part of god, are we not gods? in death all
is revealed, how is it not gain? thought kills your first reaction of kindness of word or deed, so why do you
think about it? truth does fail because no one will hear it, why do you think the world is in this situation
and state of ignorance? you yourself probably know that “satan” is deceiving. do these words surprise you?
im not illiterate in any sense, I just thinkn for myself and I dont let a few hundred elders of the church or
society tell me what to believe. their right is no better than mine.
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#50
Twisting words is lying. All what you believed today which you claimed you derived alone from your
personal experience were in fact indoctrination you received by reading books, conversation with others,
learning at the feet of….. Isn’t it? You will know nothing if you will not interact to the world, to your
fellow men, etc. But you contradict the evidences of your senses, your experiences, your common sense,
and your assumption in order to live, by what you believed and expressed in this post. You assumed Bible
truth so that you can live, but you reject it by your belief-system. Be true to yourself. Jesus is the true
truth!
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#51
twisting words is not lying, lying is lying. there are half truths, loopholes, allowing things to go without
saying anything one way or the other. none of these are lying. be specific and you cant get cuaght in the
loopholes. interaction is experince. reading is an experience. talking is an experience. learning is an
experience. i have only gone aginst that which does not serve me, which is established beliefs. i am not
saying they are wrong, they just do not serve their purpose. if a door boes not open and close, you would
not call it wrong, you would simply say that it works incorrectly, or does not serve its purpose. i was sick of
being brainwashed by the church and society. the soul will not be limited and fights any restrictions but
upon it. did not the united states start of with a saying “give me liberty or give me death”? i do not limit my
self and i go completely with my highest feelings, for god is the highest thought, clearest word and
strongest feeling. i go with all my assumptions, feelings, and common sense. how do you think i came to
hese conclusions? experience. everything is an experience.
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______________
#49 and #51 Notice how Twist/Adam the Mystic upon seeing the absurdity of his assertion at #47 took a stand out of
embarrassment by justifying his foolishness at #49 and #51 to the point of defending the different “ism” which I
enumerated at #48 (such as hedonism, irrationalism, suicide, pessimism, New Ageism, and Satanism) but excluding
atheism. This mystic is so hopeless that he will cling to lies, perversion and deception just to reject the Bible no matter
what. The Bible has something to say to this foolish infidel: “Now therefore hearken unto me, O ye children: for
blessed are they that keep my ways. Hear instruction, and be wise, and refuse it not. Blessed is the man that heareth
me, watching daily at my gates, waiting at the posts of my doors. For whoso findeth me findeth life, and shall obtain
favour of the LORD. But he that sinneth against me wrongeth his own soul: all they that hate me love death”
(Prov.8:32-36). “For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men,
who hold the truth in unrighteousness; …Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools, ...Who changed the truth
of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen. For
this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is
against nature: And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward
another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error
which was meet. And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate
mind, to do those things which are not convenient; …Who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such
things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them” (Rom.1:18-32). As to the
refutation of the mystic concept of experience, see my post at #103.
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#52
Posted by Atheist In Response to #42 ~∞~
I am a thinking person, I use my knowledge, ability to reason, “Is all hopeless? Is there no cure?
and experience when discussing a particular topic. I feel very Are we all doomed therefore to
confident when I state that the last 7 commandments, starting perpetual blindness and darkness?
with honor thy father and mother are very important social
and moral rules no matter what religion you practice, if you There is but one hope. There is but
live on this planet it makes sense to live by those general one answer. There is but one cure.
rules. There is nothing supernatural about those (the first three According to the gospel, Jesus of
I don’t believe in since that would be contradictory to
atheism). Whether the commandments come from God or the Nazareth was the only begotten
Bible is irrelevant. Son of God. He came down to earth
I do not believe in God or that the Bible is the word of God
but I respect those who do. I arrived at this understanding
because of the blindness of
through many years of studying the subject. “or your rough- mankind, because man had been
and-ready answers and judgments were produce by your deluded by the god of this world.
prejudice against it” is a little harsh judgement. “Be careful
not to judge lest be ye judged”, that is found somewhere in the He came and brought that
Bible too. treatment which alone can avail.
-------------- - ------------------ He has removed by His sacrificial,
#53 atoning death and His resurrection
Posted by Biblical Christian In Response to #52 the stain of the guilt of sin. He has
Whether the commandments which you followed in order to given new life and power to our
live meaningfully in this world come from God or the Bible is diseased and paralysed spiritual
not irrelevant. The question of origin is always important, this
fact needs no explanation. In fact, as you have said, the optic nerves. He enables us to see
commandments are very important moral and social rules no God, to behold our Father’s face.
matter what religion you practice. That’s the point, Bible
truth is absolute. You cannot live in this world without
And looking at Him, the light of
assuming its truth. How do you know that you really know the eternal countenance
that you are a thinking person who can use knowledge, ability irradiates our whole being.”
to reason, and experience when discussing a particular topic? – Martyn Lloyd-Jones, Truth Unchanged,
What is your basis in reasoning and judging goodness and Unchanging, Wheaton: Crossway Books, 1950,
morality? Your knowledge, ability to reason, experience, and pp. 103-104.
judgment of goodness and morality assumed Bible truth. The ~∞~
question that remain to be answered by atheists and by Bible
rejectors is: Why do you assumed Bible truth in order to live but with the same breath you reject it in order
to justify your atheism and unbelief which is an expression not of knowledge, ability to reason, and
experience?
-------------- - --------------------------------------
#54
all throughout the bible it talks about the wise man. the wise man this, the wise man that.but what makes
his so wise? because he thinks for himself? and who proclaims him to be wise? himself or others? if he
knows morality and what is wrong so well, who told him? and why do so many wise men differ? is it
because they figured out what is right and wrong, moral and immoral for themselves? and if so many wise
men did that, and this is how they to be wise, why is it wrong for anybody else to figure things out for
themselves?
-------------- - --------------------------------------
21
#55
As you say a wise man may be a man who figured things out for himself and usually is in agreement with
the majority. No one is infallible, everyone makes mistakes, however, when it seems to the majority that
the wise man makes a mistake or is wrong, it may be that the majority still haven’t figured out what the
wise man is talking about.
There’s a saying that goes, “It is a blessing for those who have the power to see the future and it is also a
curse for them to have to wait for others to catch up.”
It depends…
------------- - --------------------------------------
#56
im exceedingly glad that you see where im coming from in that. but what does it depend on? this why the
wise man always gets screwed in the long run because very few people are ready to hear what he is saying.
that’s why a lot of wise men choose to keep their mouths shut rather than sharing with the world, they do
not wish to be demonized and then have people understand long after they are gone. it is the work of the
soul to wake the self, but it is the work of god to awaken others.
-------------- - --------------------------------------
#57
How do you know that what you consider a wise man is indeed wise? How can you be so sure that you
have already figure things out for yourself? What is your basis for figuring things out? The Bible alone
gives the criteria how to know a fool or a wise. To consider yourself that you have already figure thing out
for yourself without in fact figuring it out is a big mistake and might be tantamount to selfishness, or worse,
insanity!
-------------- - --------------------------------------
______________
#55 and #56 At this point Louis the Atheist and Twist/Adam the Mystic cannot adjudicate who is right between the wise
man and majority. They cannot determine if the wise man is indeed wise. They measure the wiseness of man by their
opinionated opinions. They both think, based on their opinion alone, that they are wise. But the Bible judged them both
to be fool, corrupt and filthy:
“The fool hath said in his heart, There is no God. They are corrupt, they have done abominable works, there is none
that doeth good. The LORD looked down from heaven upon the children of men, to see if there were any that did
understand, and seek God. They are all gone aside, they are all together become filthy: there is none that doeth good,
no, not one” (Psa.14:1-3).
The atheist does not believe in GOD because based on his opinion there is no God. His depravity, “scientific” studies
and emotional panic to God’s final judgment at the end “confirmed” his beliefs. The same is true to the mystic or
pantheist. He does not believe in GOD because based on his opinion there is no infinite-personal God of the Bible.
What he blindly believed is that all is god. His diabolical experiences (dream, illusion, delusion, delirium, etc.) based
on Satanic interpretation “confirmed” his beliefs.
You see the Bible alone can correctly interpret the experiences of all men. It can even discern, criticize and analyze the
entire essence and existence of man himself:
“For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing
asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.
Neither is there any creature that is not manifest in his sight: but all things are naked and opened unto the eyes of him
with whom we have to do” (Heb.4:12-13).
22
#58
Posted by Mystic In Response to #57 ~∞~
(Answered by Biblical Christian at #59) “Christ said in John 14:23,
what makes you think you know a wise man from a fool? what is
your basis? the bible. of course. not to seem like a jerk or anything ‘If a man love me,
like that, but your one of those “you decide! you choose! i’ll go he will keep my words….’
along!” people, aren’t you? what makes the bible so authoritative? …If a man loves God, he will
are you not aware that a lot of the bible was passed down verbally?
and is it not true that when things get passed around that they get keep God’s words, and if he
just a little distorted? the bible was also rearranged for political loves Christ, he will keep
purposes. are you not aware of this? my basis for figuring things
out is my own personal experience. something you probably
Christ’s words. Love for God,
ignore because sometime what you feel is right or wrong conflicts without love for God’s word,
with your dogma. sorry to put it bluntly, but that is what it is: is an unknown, unheard
dogma. go look that up in the dictionary and think about the
definition. besides, what wrong with thinking for yourself? if you of thing in the Bible.”
assume wrong, then oh well you were wrong. learn from it and – Peter S. Ruckman, Theological Studies,
2 Vols., Pensacola: Bible Believers Press,
move on. and what is figuring things out to you? listening to what
1995, p. 684.
others say? thats not figuring out, thats following along. and what
is wrong with being selfish? the best person to love is the person ~∞~
who is self centered. how can you love another until you love
yourself? give to another what you want for yourself. does not the bible say love thy neighbor as thyself? if
do not love yourself and you are to love others with the same vigor, that isnt saying much for your love of
your brother, is it? and what is wrong with insanity? analyze the word for a minute, in-sanity. hmm. in
sanity. that I am. if you do not go within, you go without. with-in, with-out. if you do not go within, in-
sanity, you go without, that is, with-out.
-------------- - --------------------------------------
#59
Congratulations, you have now made a brand new “alien-ufo” dictionary of selfishness, dogma, insanity,
etc.!
How do you know that you really know what you pretend to know?
Why there is existence rather than extinction?
What are your reasons behind your belief that truth is more preferable than deception, that right is better
than wrong, and that good is higher than evil?
You cannot adequately answer these questions unless you assumed Bible truth.
The Bible is authoritative because God Himself authorized it. GOD SAID IT, I BELIEVE IT, THAT
SETTLES IT!
-------------- - --------------------------------------
#60
i do not pretend. I stoped doing that along time ago. i base my self on my personal experience. none exist,
so none can be higher than any other. what is “bible truth”? are you refering to ultimate truth, ultimate
reality? in that case….. yes i am. your dead on. still you persist with the gender thing. did you read the bible
verses i suggested?
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23
#61
Do you really base yourself on your personal experience? How can you be so sure that you have your
personal experience? What is YOUR personal experience? What makes your personal experience
possible? Are you really independent, autonomous being, by yourself, you didn’t depend on your
environment in order to live, you don’t eat, drink, etc., don’t you? You don’t depend your knowledge on
the indoctrination you received, don’t you? You don’t really depend your existence in your surrounding,
don’t you? You really created yourself out of nothing, do you? You know all things, aren’t you? You’re
dead, if you have “absolute” freedom, independence, autonomy, “godhood”, etc. Only the God of gods,
Lord of lords and King of kings who wrote the Book of books is absolute. You are a relative, dependent
being, prima facie! What is your basis that your personal experience does not deceive you as you can
found normally in the mental asylum? You cannot really answer the three basic questions (3Q) I gave to
you unless you assumed Bible truth. Jesus is the true truth.
-------------- - --------------------------------------
#62
(Answered by Biblical Christian at #74 and by Mystic at #80)
WHAT? WHAT? WHAT ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT? THAT DIDNT EVEN MAKE SENSE! you are
getting away from me, and if i cant understand you, theres a problem. you are saying almost the exact
opposite of what i am! read this very carefully, because this is the last time i will explain this to you. we are
all god. god is the all. and them some. we are pieces of god. if god did not exist, neither would we for god
is all that is. do you understand now? is it starting to register? tis what I hate about debating with myopic
people. don’t try to pull my own trick on me. your not good at twisting words, so don’t do it. get more
practice before you get in over your head. your just ranting and bearing false witness now. yes false
witness. your saying i said things i didn’t and youre editing my words. tisk tisk. now who needs to repent?
-------------- - --------------------------------------
#63
A point that I forgot before: if i didnt have my experience, who did? you obviously havent had my
experience. and another suggestion, read the gospels again. compare to what i have said, if you think about
it, you will see that we are saying the same thing. not you and me, me and the bible.
-------------- - --------------------------------------
#64
(Answered by Mystic at #62 and #70)
You still forgot to write your real and true name. You cannot depend on deceiving experience as your
ultimate standard to know good and evil, right and wrong, righteousness and sins, etc. You are not God!
That’s the point, got it? Don’t forget it.
-------------- - --------------------------------------
______________
#62 You’ll notice here that Twist/Adam the mystic is very inconsistent in his belief that “contradictory “truths’” can
exist because he hate me when he wrote “i cant understand you, theres a problem. you are saying almost the exact
opposite of what i am!”. Further, he refuted his belief by contradicting me over and over again. He believed that we
are god and god is all but he attempted and tried with all his effort to convince that I am god and that he is god.
Foolishness!!! You don’t need to talk to anyone or convince anyone if you are god and all is god. God does not only
know who he is but also knows all things! Infidel’s belief-system messed their minds.
24
#65 ~∞~
Posted by Mystic In Response to #64 “Several Christians have asked me how we
(Answered by Biblical Christian at #66 and #72)
HAPPY? dont even come at me with some crap could resist brainwashing. There is only one
that i am refusing to do anything when i have not method of resistance to brainwashing. This
even gotten the chance to read any of your myopic
rantings. now i have a few things i would like to is "heartwashing." If the heart is cleansed by
say. no, i am not of a twisted or deceitful mind or the love of Jesus Christ, and if the heart
whatever it was you said, i just know how to play loves Him, you can resist all tortures. What
games with words and find loopholes. and why
dont you explain to me what is so deceiving about would a loving bride not do for a loving
experince. it is the most real, most personal thing bridegroom? What would a loving mother
that is in life. obviosly you had some real screwed
up experiences. or maybe your experiencing
not do for her child? If you love Christ as
immaturity and denial. i don’t know im not you Mary did, who had Christ as a baby in her
(well, i am, but im sure you can put together arms, if you love Jesus as a bride loves her
anything from the bible). obviously you did not
read what is in the book of isaiah, or did not
bridegroom, then you can resist such
understand it. either way i dont care, its your tortures. God will judge us not according
problem. i said god created all and all is perfect to how much we endured, but how much we
and you cannot do wrong. isaiah 45:7 says “ i have
created the light and darkness, good and evil. i the could love. I am a witness for the Christians
lord god made all these things”. the difference in Communist prisons that they could love.
between me and the bible is where? i am god. the They could love God and men. The tortures
father and i are one. god is all there is, all there
was, and all there will ever be. nothing less. all you and brutality continued without
see, do, feel, hear, ARE is GOD. do you interruption. When I lost consciousness or
understand this? you have violated gods law many
times throughout our debate. condemn not the path
became too dazed to give the torturers any
of another, or as you understand it, judge ye not further hopes of confessions, I would be
lest ye shall be judged. and ye who surely you are returned to my cell. There I would lie,
the one who is mistake. tell me I am not god. i dont
care. tell me that i am wrong and not god, but iam untended and half dead, to regain a little
no less, nore any more god than you. love thy strength so they could work on me again.
neighbor as thyself. the bible says that too. maybe Many died at this stage, but somehow my
you should improve your understanding of the
bible before you come back. Think about my strength always managed to come back. In
words. Compare them to each other. you will se the ensuing years, in several different
the similarities. write down what i have said if you prisons, they broke four vertebrae in my
cannot remember my words. i have been saved
many times, in many ways, but i tell you this: the back, and many other bones. They carved me
light at the end of the tunnel may be you. you are in a dozen places. They burned and cut
trying to find yourself. that’s why you came here.
this is good. maybe I am your wake up call. also,
eighteen holes in my body. Doctors in Oslo,
love thy enemy. you become angry to the point of seeing all this and the scars of the lung
hating me. do unto the least of my brethren……i tuberculosis which I also had, declared that
also want to make one more thing clear for you. i
do not threaten you with hell or any such thing, for my being alive today is a pure miracle!
i do not believe in it. and finally, i want to let you According to their medical books, I should
know one thing: if you do not stop with this have been dead for years. I know myself it is
ignorant ranting, name calling, insulting, slander,
or condemning (judging) this conversation will be a miracle. God is a God of miracles.”
over. its not a threat, its not a promise, its what will – Richard Wurmbrand, Tortured for Christ, 1967, p.41.
happen. the only reason I have put up with it for ~∞~
this long is because i am very patient. maybe you
will consider my leaving you a blessing. i don’t
25
know, i am not you. the choice of both our experience is up to you. you can allow me to enlighten you, or
push me away. its all on you. but some advice, follow your heart for it is the dwelling place of the lord and
will not guide you wrong.
------------- - --------------------------------------
#66
At least you now starting to learn how to give reasons beyond kindergarten level, but you go to the extreme
by becoming a professional liar. You said that I hate you, no, it is just the twisted interpretation of your
Adamic, unbelieving heart and mind, full of hate and rebellion (Rom.3:10-20; 13:8-10; 10:4). I do not hate
you at all; in fact, I love you all so I try to explain what God says in the Bible about the real meaning of life
which can be found alone in the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ Who now lives, the present reality, in every
true believers. If I hate you, then I will say what you have said that you don’t care anymore whatever I
admonish. But since I love you, I don’t want you to remain in the quagmire of misconception and
deception, God only used me to evangelize you, to point you the way, the path, the life, the truth, the light,
He is the God of gods, the Master of masters, Lord of lords and King of kings. He is the Lord and Saviour
Jesus Christ. I hold the Bible to preach, to reprove, to correct, and instruct you in righteousness (2
Tim.3:16) which you always assumed as long as you live but you immediately reject with your expressed
opinions, ideas and beliefs. Inconsistency. You are now starting to surrender, to stop our on-line
discussion, for the more you express your beliefs, the more you expose your Satanic deception, self-
delusion, irrationalism, depravity, schizophrenic hypocrisy, etc. Read Matt.23:13-33; Rom.2:1-23; 2 Pet.
2:9-22; Jd. 1:4-19).
------------- - --------------------------------------
#67
YOU know what the twisted things is? we are both here to do basicly the same thing. you want to save me,
and i want to help you save yourself. you believe god put you in this situation with me for you to help me,
and feel i am supposed to be helping you. i would appreciate it if you would stop saying that i am lying,
because i am doing far from that. it takes a great deal of maturity to see that two seemingly contradictory
truths can exist at the same time. it is actually kind of pointless for us to continue this debate. you are
unwilling to see a different point of view, and i have already experienced yours. i used to be quite the
christian just to let you know. i love you because we all are one. you love me because we are all the human
family of god. to be honest with you, im becoming bored with this anyways. i just keep repeating myself.
im almost ready to give up. but you called me disbelieving and satanic. how was anything i have said even
remotely sounded like i do not believe in god? i believe in god just the same as you, just not the same way.
do know what satan translates to in in english? it means adversary or opponent. what is wrong with a
satanic view point? if nothing had opposition, we would be living under communism right now. of course i
twist things. how else can you see the real meaning? you have to read between the lines. think for yourself.
we are so similar its scary. we just have different perspectives. to wake the self is the work of the soul, but
to wake others is the work of god. what you want for yourself, give to another. go out and preech the gospel
to the ends of the earth (wake others). do unto others as you would them do unto you (what you want for
yourself, give to another). are you seeing it now?
-------------- - --------------------------------------
#68
All what you have said to me backfires to you. Why your mind was so narrow-minded that you cannot see
what I have wrote about the truth? Jesus is the true truth!
-------------- - --------------------------------------
26
#69 ~∞~
Posted by Mystic In Response to #68 “There is a God-shaped vacuum
(Answered by Biblical Christian at #72 and #97)
you are really starting to get on my nerves with this jesus is in the heart of every man that
the true truth crap. no kidding. tell me something i didnt cannot be filled by any created
already now. Jesus spoke nothing but the truth. you just dont
understand what he was saying. how many times do i have to thing, but by God alone made
keep quoting the man before you realize what is going on? known through Jesus Christ.”
and you can stop preaching about how i am wrong to proclaim – Blaise Pascal, quoted by David Jeremiah,
my self as a part of god now. i am the way and the life. how Searching for Heaven on Earth,
arrogant is that? jesus said that. but he never said to be the son Brentwood: Integrity
of god.he said thati and the father are one. people just Publishers, Inc., 2004, p. 19.
assumed he meant he was god manifested in the flesh. he was ~∞~
of course, but not in the way you understand it. He also said,
what thou doest unto the least of my brethren, so shall have done it unto me. you know how that’s possible?
because we all are one. you are not ready to understand this yet, and that’s ok. you may not be for some
time. but you will eventually.
-------------- - --------------------------------------
#70
I am god. so are you. so is all that is. got it? you and i are one, and i am one with the father. whats so hard
about this? god is all there is, and all there is IS ALL THERE IS! nothing les! jeez. what is with you?
understand before you reply.
-------------- - --------------------------------------
#71
Posted by New Ager One In Response to #70
YES!!!!!!Thank you, for it is the energy of the entire cosmos {God} that exists in each and every one of us
together!!!! We are God and when the energy reaches a critical mass, or the spiritual power of all beings in
which God exists finally becomes truly one from the result of our spiritual enlightenment we will truly be
and experience the truly awesome power of energy and god which are one. The Spirit is in each of us. We
find God within us for we are made in his image from day one. The perfection of God lies in the spiritual
power of each of us!!!!! We need to stop looking outside to arrange our lifes. For it is within that we are
allknowing and all powerful in his image!!!!!! A true uniting of beings to this principle will lead to mass
spiritual and menatal powers beyond our beliefs. A heaven of sorts you could venture to say.
Peace to you and all life. Pray for the enlightenment of all humanity.
If you agree I would like to hear back from you. God bless.
P.S. There is a scientific basis for all of this. The argument has ended to for those who seek the truth will
find it!!!!
-------------- - --------------------------------------
______________
#69, #70 and #71 Delusion is the guiding “light” of all mystics, yogis, Gnostics, neo-pagans, and New agers. If
Lucifer had tried to usurp the Godhood of God, Satan’s followers want to usurp the Christhood of Christ. Now, let me
give you established facts about the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ. He was a Jew born of a virgin with royal
genealogies, circumcised on the eight day, grow with wisdom in favor of God and of man, baptized by John the Baptist,
overcome the tempter in the desert, sinless, prayerfully lived, worked meaningful miracles, suffered and died on the
cross to save us, resurrected on the third day with power and glory, and will come again as Davidic king in the
Millennium. All of these were already written afore in the O.T. prophecies and in N.T. writings. Can anyone imitate
his “Christhood”? Only an insane and a fool will answer in the affirmative.
27
#72
Posted by Biblical Christian In Response to #64, #69, #70 and #71
Previously, you wrote “I’m not you”, but now you wrote “you and I are one”. Absurd, inconsistent, self-
defeating, self-condemned responses. You are god indeed if you asked those lunatic, insane, crazy, and
mad in the mental asylum; if you asked those Devil-worshippers, Luciferians, New Agers, Satanists,
eastern gurus, masters, mystics, demon-possessed egotists and witches they will tell you that you are one of
the gods emanated from the One; if you asked those pseudo-intellectuals, skeptics, critics, atheists,
humanists, agnostics, naturalists, and egomaniacs they will tell you that you are god of your own making,
but if you asked the God of gods, the Master of masters, the Lord of lords and the King of kings Who wrote
the Book of books, He will tell you that you are a rebel, sinner, fool, and deceived crown of creation who
needs salvation. Only the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ can save you from such delusion and deception.
Repent now, and believe in Him alone. Join us in the Heaven of heavens, God’s children and His angels
wait for you.
-------------- - --------------------------------------
#73
you and i are one, but i am not you. a perfect example of two seemingly contradictory truths existing at
once. we are both part of a whole, part of god. But i am not you. we are two different pieces. different parts
of the one.but we are one none the less. why are you waitng for me? im not going any where. you are the
one who needs to take a walk. i will tell something a friend of mine said to me once: “take a look at a day.”
see the sky. look at the colors of the leaves turning on the trees. the absolute beauty of a sunset. how can
anything so beautiful and magnificent not be god? if our world is so flawed, how can it be so awesome? i
and the father are one, and what thou doest to the lest of my brethren, so shalt thou have done it unto me.
god does not punish, god loves. your prents are the greatest love you will experince of another person. yet
they punish you. so if god loves you more, the greater the punishment must be. would the mother of all
destroy or torture that which he so loveingly made? god, who is perfect, made a race of imperfect beings
with the will to defy him, and then punish them for using that which was given to them. does this make any
sense at all? no. it does not.if you do not want your children to play certain games, do you give them the
toys? why would you punish your children for playing with what you gave them? and why would god want
something so bad as to command it, then sit around and watch it not be done? who god command, itself?
that’s not omnipotence if you cant get that which you made to listen to you. why don’t you stop selling god
short. you limit god, and in doing so, have limited yourself. you deny that god is all powerful and yet you
say she is in the same conversation. why don’t you stop contradicting yourself. i have created the light and
the darkness, good and evil. i the lord god have made both these things. yet you say he didn’t. but then you
say she is omnipotent. and he is all powerful. they say we are imperfect and need salvation. then say god is
perfect. but it created imperfection. ummm, DUH. can we say illogical, and contradictory. i love god. i do
not limit god. you do. you place restraints on your love. and the soul is free, and will not be limited.
-------------- - --------------------------------------
#74
Why are you still hiding in your pseudoname, petname, “godname”: TWIST?
Obviously, by that name you can write what you want to write even that is an expression of your twisted
mind. You just cannot answered my refutations of your “arguments”. You are “god” indeed if your
definition of god is “Gone Or Dead”. You are dead in trespasses and sins (Eph.2:1), you need the Lord and
Saviour Jesus Christ, He alone can save you.
-------------- - --------------------------------------
28
#75 ~∞~
Posted by Mystic In Response to #74 “If God made us for his glory, it is
(Answered by Biblical Christian at #76) clear that we should live for his
thereis no secret that will not be revealed. my screenname
matters not.
glory. Our duty comes from
what is with you? God’s design.”
-------------- - ------------------ – John Piper, Desiring God, Manila: Christian
Growth Ministries, Inc, 1996, p. 55.
#76
~∞~
By hiding your real name, you can post anything which you want to express just to justify your
unjustifiable justification of you unjust beliefs. You have no true name to protect for your dignity and
integrity, you can lie when you want it. That’s it. Be honest.
-------------- - --------------------------------------
#77
i cannot lie. it is against my laws. you better believe i can post anything to justify my beliefs. and they are
very justifiable.
-------------- - --------------------------------------
#78
Why you cannot lie? Why lying is against your laws? Again, you assumed Bible truth but you reject it by
what you expressed in your posts. Be true to yourself. Don’t be deceived. Be honest. Jesus is the true
truth!
-------------- - --------------------------------------
#79
i cannot lie because to lie would be to go against my own morals, and that would be to betray myself. to
betray myself would not be true to myself or others. when you find god, you shall not bare false witness.
-------------- - --------------------------------------
#80
i forgot one thing ISAIAH 45:7. YOU DO OWN A BIBLE DONT YOU? are we having fun yet?
ISAIAH 45:7 ISAIAH 45:7 ISAIAH 45:7 or are you afraid to read it?
-------------- - --------------------------------------
#81
Isaiah 45:7 is one of my favorite verses which proved that God is indeed omniscient, omnipresent and
omnipotent. God, as revealed in the Bible, is the sovereign Lord Who created, governed and maintained all
things, not like you who claimed to be “god” who cannot even create an amoeba which can be found in
your stomach which you served right now.
-------------- - --------------------------------------
#82
why don’t you go look all those big words up in the dictionary. i know what they all mean, do you? all
present, all powerful. hmmm. sounds familiar. oh i know why! thats exactly what i have been saying. ALL
29
present, as in being everything. thank you. we finally agree on something. i guess you don’t care for matt
7:1 do you? or the sermon on the mount? makes you remove too many planks from thy own eye, huh?
-------------- - --------------------------------------
#83
You know not what is the meaning of what you have cited out of its context. I have already explained it.
But I need to explain to you again, and for those who can read this post, those verses which you don’t
understand. Isa.45:7, I repeat, is about God’s sovereignty, His omnipotence, omniscience and
omnipresence is clearly expressed in this verse with its context. The word evil (Heb. ra’a’) has a wide
meaning depending upon its context, it is never rendered “sin”. In Psalms, it is rendered “calamities”
(141:5); “adversity” (94:13); and “trouble” (41:1). It is rendered “naughty” in 2 Kings 2:19 and Jeremiah
24:2, etc. As in the text, by contrasting it with the word “peace”, it does not mean moral evil, but evil
inflicted as a judgment for man’s iniquity. Read Jer.18:11-17; Lam.3:38-40; Amos 3:2-11; 5:12-15.
Regarding Matt.7:1, you are right if, and only if, that is the only verse in the whole Bible. But the Bible has
31,102 verses. You cannot use it to tell me not to judge you wrong, unsave, and fool. You must read its
context and compare it to 1 Cor.2:15, 16; 6:1,2; Rom.2:1-3. The Bible, therefore, tells us that we must not
judge no one if we are to judge him by our own sinful, imperfect standard. Only through the Word of God,
the Bible in which all laws, constitutions and rules must be based, that we can rightly judged a person to be
either right or wrong, save or unsave, innocent or guilty, wise or fool, etc. to admonish him. I repeat, you
always assumed Bible truth in order to live but you hold it in unrighteousness (Rom1:18-23).
-------------- - --------------------------------------
#84
(Answered by Mystic at #85 and by Biblical Christian at #86)
Recently, you’ve started to sound like those Dianetics commercials that say, “To learn why you still don’t
know how to tie your own shoes, read Page 95.”
Seriously, don’t you have your own site for Preaching the Bible? Here on this site we kick around ideas
that do or don’t make sense depending on your beliefs. Most of us don’t preach, we discuss different points
of view and let it go at that. You may not agree with someone, you may feel that you have the best basis
for your response, but, please don’t preach, or condemn someone for having a different opinion. Try to be
nice, even to Twist!
On your post, I can’t consult the Bible for every idea or situation I am confronted with, the Bible was
written thousands of years ago, and some of it is very good and as books go, it’s better for someone to read
it than spend a lifetime without reading it. But remember, more people reject its religious teachings and
theological truth than accept it.
-------------- - --------------------------------------
#85
thanks louis
-------------- - --------------------------------------
#86
Thanks for the sermon. You are a “good” preacher. However, you expressed yourself that you have an
emotional panic as I quote the Bible. Why? You assumed Bible truth as your experience, knowledge,
reason tells you but you reject it with your expressed beliefs, ideas, and opinions. T-H-I-N-K!!!!!!!
-------------- - --------------------------------------
30
#87 ~∞~
Posted by Mystic In Response to #86 “It may be that in the phrase
(Answered by Professing Christian at #88 and by Biblical Christian at #97)
i have been thinking all my life. in fact, i barely ever stop. im Christ is All we have the
not the one who panics when the bible is quoted. you avoid summing of all truth, the most
my thrusts all together. at least i dont back down from the
challenge. i have said many things and asked many questions profound statement in the
that you have completely ignored, over and over again. i can Bible. The more one reflects on
see not bothering to answer once or twice because you are it and realizes its implications,
tired or do not have time, but not over and over again. as i
have said before, the bible is not an authoritative source of the more one realizes that it is
anything. you put too much stock in what god supposedly so. Christianity is Christ; God
said, and not enough in what god shows you all the time.
when the experience conflicts with the page, discard the page.
to us now is Christ; all Truth is
if your experince brings you a higher vision of who you are Christ; everything that is holy,
and seems right, even if it conflicts with the book, go with right and beautiful is found in
what you feel is right. why would the heart that god dwels in
lead you wrong?
Him; Christ is indeed ALL.
-------------- - ------------------ How long will it be before we
#88 and all professing Christians
Posted by Professing Christian In Response to #87 realize and act upon this fact
You call yourself a “Metaphist”. I would really like to know in our life and witness?”
the details of this belief system. At times you sound like a – Stuart Allen, The Unfolding Purpose of
Christian, but you say you don’t believe in heaven or hell, or God, London: The Berean Publishing
Trust, 1961, p. 155.
do you?
I will say that I agree with most of what you say. I consider ~∞~
myself a “skeptical Christian” because I disregard parts of the
bible which seem incorrect. This book was definitely written by people, and has many flaws. There are also
many books which are in some bibles, and not others. The Catholic and Orthodox bibles have the books of
Sirach and Wisdom, which are both quite interesting. And there are many other books which are not
recognized by any church that I think are worth reading. I also don’t think the bible should end where it
does. It would be a lot better if it also documented all of the falures and successes of the church over its
history. The bible cannot be complete if it doesn’t warn people against fundamentalist thought and fear
tactics. The bible should let everyone know about the insanity of the crusades and inquisitions. Many
Christians today know little about these events, and are repeating the same mistakes.
-------------- - --------------------------------------
#89
(No One Answered)
NOW YOU’VE DONE IT! Look out, and don’t forget to duck!
-------------- - --------------------------------------
______________
#88 and #89 Let us make this clear that crusades and inquisitions were not done by Biblical Christians but by so-called
Christians (Roman Catholic) who persecuted, tortured and murdered the Biblical Christians. Read and research the
history, specifically, the Foxe Books of Martyrs. Since Louis the Atheist cannot directly confront me with arguments,
he tried to “tempt” others to do so. So far, we have seen that all the arguments of infidels are nothing but simply an
expression of their fanatic bigotry, arrogant stupidity, and full-bloomed ignorance of God and His words. They want
to give emphasis that many had been killed in the name of “Christian” religion. They are wrong. Millions had been
killed in the name of Popism (Roman Catholicism), Mohammedanism (Islam), Marxism (Communism), Hitlerism
(Nazism), Buddhism (Eastern mysticism), Secularism (world war I and world war II, gang wars, civil wars, revolutions,
rebellions, terrorism), etc. etc.
31
#90
brandon, I really wouldnt wast my time on arguing with peri. he feels that everyone else but him is talking
nonsense. the only reason i do is because it is an experience i felt like experiencing. i am very happy to
have so many other people joining in on the “fun” peri and i are having. i was started to get real bored. in
answer to your question of metaphism, i really am not sure how one might describe it. i believe that we all
are one. what is good for one is good for another and what harms one harms others. i believe that as a race
we are very primitive, and have a great deal of understanding to achieve, of both god and ourselves. i
believe we are all god. god is a collective being and a single being all at once. i believe that two seemingly
contradictory truths can exist at the same time. there is no right or wrong. there is no sin. there is only
perfection. life is all there is and ever will be, which is god. truth, love, and joy are all the same and are
interchangeable, for one leads to the others and all lead to god. all are god. you asked, so here ya go. this is
only a brief summary of my beliefs. it is actually much more complicated than this, but these are the basic
ideas. it is also not an organized thing. organized religion takes the emphisis off of the individual and on the
“established truths”. religion and spirituality are very personal things, therefore can never be dictated to you
by another. there is no real system. we just are what we are, because there is nothing else to be. thats the
basic idea.
-------------- - --------------------------------------
#91
(No One Answered)
For once, your post makes sense. I don’t agree with most of it, but you do make yourself clear about your
beliefs and the way you phrase the basic theories makes it easier to understand you.
“i believe that we all are one. what is good for one is good for another and what harms one harms others. i
believe that as a race we are very primitive, and have a great deal of understanding to achieve, of both god
and ourselves. i believe we are all god.”
“We all are one”, one human race, part of the animal kingdom of this Earth. What each person does will
affect the other is true. You say that religions take the emphasis off the individual. In a way too much
emphasis is placed on individuals and sometimes the individual is saved and the rest of the group is put in
jeopardy. I think that humanity as a whole is in jeopardy and we should all try to protect the species as a
whole.
I would strongly suggest you read Isaac Asimov’s Robot Series starting with “Caves of Steel”, the “Naked
Sun” and “Robots of Dawn”. These are science fiction but you can get a lot of understanding about our
place in this universe from these books, besides the fact that they are very enjoyable reading.
-------------- - --------------------------------------
______________
#90
Let us enumerate the eleven (11) diabolical doctrines of Twist/Adam the Mystic:
1. all are one. what is good for one is good for another and what harms one harms others. 2. as a race we are very
primitive, and have a great deal of understanding to achieve, of both god and ourselves. 3. we are all god. 4. god is a
collective being and a single being all at once. 5. two seemingly contradictory truths can exist at the same time. 6.
there is no right or wrong. 7. there is no sin. there is only perfection. 8. life is all there is and ever will be, which is
god. 9. truth, love, and joy are all the same and are interchangeable, for one leads to the others and all lead to god.
10. organized religion takes the emphasis off of the individual and on the “established truths”. religion and spirituality
are very personal things, therefore can never be dictated to you by another. 11. there is no real system. we just are
what we are, because there is nothing else to be.
Let me briefly refute and criticize each dogma:

#1 destroys individuality and uniqueness. #2 assumed the existence of extra-Earth carbon-based life known as U.F.O.
or aliens. #3, #8 and #9 are simply diabolical pantheism. #4 is a blasphemous contradiction. #5 is illogical and
absurd; the word “seemingly” is an illusion of meaning. #6 and #7 if true would render life meaningless, insane and
anarchic. #10 and #11 if true would render all discussions, explanations, communications, innovations,
transformations, revolutions, corrections, and reformations, etc. vain, futile, worthless, and useless
32
#92 ~∞~
Posted by Christian Two In Response to #91 “The soul is awakened to God
(Answered by Critic at #93, by Biblical Christian at #94, and by Professing
Christian at #108) chiefly by the Spirit of God
Brandon, sorry to barge in like this but I couldn’t resist in
responding. Please take no offense if I sound a bit hard but
as he pierces our souls
you are either a skeptic or a Christian. You cannot be both. with the Word of God.”
Remember, the word “Christian” comes from “Christ” and He – R. C. Sproul, The Soul’s Quest for God,
definitely was not a skeptic. Second, which parts of the Bible Wheaton: Tyndale House Publishers, Inc.,
seem incorrect? Please elaborate! That is due cause lack of 1992, pp. 21.
details but when examined closely I have found that the Bible ~∞~
harmonizes beautifully. I challenge you or anyone else to
prove just one, only one contradiction within the pages of the Bible itself. I bet it cannot be done. Another
thing, Christ believed implicitly in the Bible of His day, the Old Testament. He held to a very high view of
the Scriptures and He refered to them as the very words of God. The Bible couldn’t let people know of the
“insanity of the crusades and inquisitions” because they occurred over a thousand years after the last book
of the Bible was written. Yet, we have history that tell us all the atrocities done in the name of God by
those who claim to be of God. Besides, the Bible does not hide all the sin and evil done by those who were
believers of God (of course, up to where it was written).
-------------- - --------------------------------------
#93
http://skepticannotatedbible.com/index.html
http://members.aol.com/ckbloomfld/index.html
http://web2.airmail.net/capella/aguide/
These three sites I found by searching on “Bible contradictions”. There are other sites that seek to explain
these apparent contradictions.
Angel, there is nothing I could say that will change you mind, so I won’t try. But it’s absurd to say that
there are no contradictions in the Bible. It’s possible to rationalize them, but they are there.
-------------- - --------------------------------------
#94
(Answered by Christian Two at #95)
You’re right Angel, you hit the nail on its head, this is what my website is all about: to exhibit,
demonstrate, show, prove, etc. that the Bible which is the perfect word of God is inerrant. No one can
prove that it has contradiction even one. All the so-called contradictions or discrepancies listed by infidels
are all the product of misconceptions, misinterpretations, and deceptions. I have thoroughly studied all the
so-called contradictions but instead of discouragement, because we are one with the myriads of true
believers in Christ our Lord, I found much blessing to see the intricate, perfect, beautiful, astounding,
amazing, breath-taking, marvelous harmony and unity of God’s Words as found in the King James Bible,
the Authorized word of God for us today with its O.T. Hebrew Masoretic text and N.T. Greek Receptus
text, as used by the Bible-believing churches throughout the history. Of course, the light cannot be seen by
the blind, perfection cannot be understood by imperfect mind, unity, beauty and harmony cannot be
perceived by perverted and distorted mind and senses, thus we have to see and study the Bible through the
guidance of the Holy Spirit in our inner, inward, newly created, spiritual nature. The Bible is true because
Jesus is the true truth, He alone is the Truth of truths!
-------------- - --------------------------------------
______________
#93 Visit the following Christian websites which thoroughly refuted the skeptic/critic/infidel websites:
http://www.rationalchristianity.net
http://www.tektonics.org
http://www.gotquestions.org
http://skepticsannotatedbible.org
http://www.christiananswers.net
33
#95
Posted by Christian Two In Response to #94
Amen, I can see that you are well familiarized not only with the Bible and its arguments, but with the
correct “text” of the Bible: textus receptus/masoretic text. I understand exactly where you are coming from
and I agree totally with what you say. My brother, the only thing I disagree with you is you approach in
(don’t know what to call it), witnessing, more like preaching to Brandon, Adam and Chris. I guess you
might justify it by saying that you are telling them the truth and they will be accountable for it. Believe me,
they are not really listening to you. You lost them awhile back. Are you telling them the Truth (the written
truth, the Bible bears witness to the living Word, the Lord Jesus Christ) because you really love these
faceless persons? Though they might be mislead, lost and spiritually bankcrupt and on their way to a
Christless eternity (sorry folks, but according to the Bible, if the Spirit of God is not residing in you, then
you are none of His), do you really care enough to be sensitive to their arguments, though you do not agree
with them. You must show them Christ, not only by carefully reasoned-out (this is important), but by the
love of God which has been shed abroad in our hearts by the Holy Spirit. So my brother, change the
attitude and let the true Truth shine forth. Please don’t be angry at me I felt like of Him to tell you. God
bless.
-------------- - --------------------------------------
#96
(No One Answered)
Beatitude attitude is what all Christians must follow. I really agree with you 100%. The mind of Christ is
the mind needed by all of us, we must always transform by the renewing of our mind to conform to Jesus
our Lord based on the Bible and not on this world. Let us have the unity of faith in the Spirit.
-------------- - --------------------------------------
#97
Posted by Biblical Christian In Response to #36, #51, #69, #79, and #87
What is experience? How can you know that you have your own experience? What makes your personal
experience possible? What is your basis of interpreting your experience as you interpret it in order to
understand it, that it is not to what you know it is? What is contradiction? How do you know that a thing,
ideas, opinions, concepts, propositions, etc. contradict one another? How can you know which one serves
its purpose and which one is not? How can truth contradict itself if it is true at all? HOW DO YOU
KNOW THAT YOU REALLY KNOW WHAT YOU PRETEND TO KNOW? WHY THERE IS
SOMETHING RATHER THAN NOTHING AT ALL? WHY THERE IS ORDER RATHER THAN
CHAOS RIGHT NOW? WHY THERE IS EXISTENCE RATHER THAN EXTINCTION? WHAT IS
YOUR REASON BEHIND YOUR BELIEF THAT TRUTH IS MORE PREFERABLE THAN
DECEPTION, RIGHT IS BETTER THAN WRONG AND GOOD IS HIGHER THAN EVIL? You cannot
adequately answer these questions unless you assumed Bible truth. Jesus is the true truth. You assumed
Bible truth in your experience, perception, common sense, ability to reason, etc. but you deny, reject,
contradict, disprove them all by your belief-system or framework of interpreting your “experiences”
because of deception. Be true to yourself, to your experience, to your perception, to your common sense, to
your ability to reason, etc. JESUS IS THE TRUTH OF TRUTHS!
-------------- - --------------------------------------
______________
#95 Even Christians misinterpret my approach as too harsh. But as you can see, my apologetic method is faithful to
God’s word; I speak the truth in love. It is just too effective and powerful that infidels had not been able to handle the
materials I gave to them. This is indeed “hard sayings”.
34
#98 ~∞~
Posted by Mystic In Response to #97 “The study of God is not only
(Answered by Truth-Seeker Two at #99 and by Biblical Christian at #103)
ALRIGHT LOOK PERI, I HAVE BEEN EXCEEDINLY the most meaningful and the
PATIENT WITH YOU. I HAVE EXPLAINED THE SAME most authentic pursuit in life,
THINGS TO YOU OVER, AND OVER, AND OVER
AGAIN AND STILL YOU DO NOT UNDERSTAND. THIS it is also the most beneficial.
IS THE LAST TIME. THE LAST. DO YOU UNDERSTAND Nothing will benefit you more
THAT? IF I DID NOT HAVE MY EXPERIENCE, WHO IS? in day-to-day living than
OBVIOUSLY NOT YOU. WHAT MAKES YOU THINK
MY EXPERIENCE IS NOT REAL? WHAT MAKES the knowledge of God.”
YOURS ANY MORE “REAL” THAN MINE? I HAVENT – Tony Evans, Our God is Awesome,
HAD ANYONE ELSES EXPERIENCES, SO I DONT Manila: OMF Literature Inc., 1994, pp. 27.
KNOW HOW THEY COULDNT BE MINE. WHY DONT ~∞~
YOU DEFINE CONTRADICTION FOR YOURSELF INSTEAD OF ASKING ME. WHAT SERVES ITS
PURPOSE DOES SO. TAKE OUR CONVERSATION FOR EXAMPLE. THIS DOES NOT SERVE ITS
PURPOSE. IT IS NOT BENEFITING EITHER OF US. IT IS UNPRODUCTIVE, AND TEHREFORE
NOT FUNCTIONING ITS PURPOSE. WHY DONT YOU LOOK AT WHO IS PRETENDING.I HAVE
COME TO THIS THROUGH MY OWN EXPERIENCE. YOU READ A BOOK. ONE IS NO MORE
CREDIBLE THAN THE OTHER, BUT AT LEAST I EARNED MY KNOWLEDGE FOR MYSELF,
UNLIKE YOU, WHO FOLLOWED ALONG WITH WHAT WAS TAUGHT TO YOU. WHY DON’T
YOU FIGURE THESE THINGS OUT FOR YOURSELF. ALL YOU ARE GOING TO DO IS COME
BACK AT WHATEVER ANSWER I GIVE YOU WITH SOME JESUS IS THE TRUE TRUTH
MONOLOUGE, SO IM NOT GOING TO BOTHER PERHAPS YOU ENJOY LIVING IN THE
ILLUSION YOU EXIST IN. THAT’S FINE. EACH SOUL MUST WALK ITS OWN PATH. I PREFERE
TO EXPERIENCE ULTIMATE REALITY. THAT IS MY PATH, SO JUDGE NOT. IT IS NOT YOUR
PLACE. I DEFINE MY MORALS. I DEFINE RIGHT AND WRONG FOR MYSELF. IF YOU CANT,
THAT’S YOUR PROBLEM. I MAY REPLY TO YOUR OTHER POST, THEN AGAIN I MAY NOT. IF
I DO, IT WILL BE FOR THE LAST TIME BECAUSE THIS CONVERSATION IS OVER. WHETHER
YOU UNDERSTAND OR NOT IS YOUR PROBLEM, NOT MINE. WHEN YOU CAN HAVE A
LOGICAL CONVERSATION, WE SPEAKE AGAIN. UNTILL THEN, GO BACT TO YOUR BIBLE
THUMPING WEB SITE,OR AT LEAST LEAVE ME THE HELL ALONE.
-------------- - --------------------------------------
#99
Posted by Truth-Seeker Two In Response to #98
Hi, I’m a university student studying Education. I am researching the search for meaning for my religion
and theology assessment. Could you tell me what role does religion play in your life. Have you had a
religious experience and if so how did these experiences contribute to the way you understand religion?
How does religion contribute to a sense of meaning in your life? If you could help me out I’d be very
appreciative. Thank you.
-------------- - --------------------------------------
#100
(Answered by New Ager Two at #101)
Religion is the method used by men to find God in search for truth but the Bible is the expression of God to
show men that Jesus is the Truth of truths. All men have religion, there is an inward vacuum in their
innermost being that only the God of gods can fill. All men assumed Bible truth in order to live, it is true to
their experience, perception, commonsense, and ability to reason; but they reject it due to the indoctrination
they received from the sinful heart of man himself and from the deception of devils. Men have insatiably
filled it with their inventions under the sun but none is permanent. Only the eternal God Himself can fill
the emptiness and longings experienced by all men. The true religion is the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ
alone! Jesus is the true truth.
-------------- - --------------------------------------
35
#101
Posted by New Ager Two In Response to #100
Why r u so bent on pushing Christianity bulls**t? now don’t get me wrong I belive that Jesus christ died on
the cross at calvery for our sins and all that jazz, but are you taking this testimony thing to far trying to
prove adam wrong. Why can’t u accept that other people have different beliefs than you?
Now, like you, I believe that christ is the son of god, but I can’t believe that he is the son of god anymore
than you or I. if you can’t accept me for my beliefs then there just one thing you should and that is GET
STUFFED!
-------------- - --------------------------------------
#102
(No One Answered)
If you will try to know the God of gods and understand the Book of books by your own perverted,
distorted, imperfect, sinful, unrighteous and deceived heart and mind, they you will not find yourself in the
Heaven of heavens because you do not believed in the Master of masters, Lord of lords and King of kings
as the Saviour of saviours. The Bible is true because the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ is the true truth, He
alone is the Truth of truths!
-------------- - --------------------------------------
#103
You cannot really make your personal experience in particular and human experience in general as your
ultimate criterion, adequate test, inerrant standard, and final authority of truth. It is so obvious to those who
really know. You used your experience as a means of knowing the truth but the truth does not originally
reside in your experiences. You used your experience as your means of understanding the truth but the
interpretation of truth will not be found in your experience. Your “personal” experience is not the source of
truth; it is not even self-interpreting. You must have some basis how to know whether your interpretation of
your experience is true or false, right or wrong, truth or deception, etc. You cannot experience all things,
you cannot experience nothing, you can only experience something. And that something must be defined in
order to distinguish it from what it is not so that you can understand it. You cannot look into a dead tree and
said that it is a living dog at you unless you are just lying, joking, have an illusion, etc. You cannot look to
yourself through a mirror and said that you are really President Clinton, let alone the God of gods, unless
you have delusion, delirium or you are insane, demon-possessed, demented egomaniac, illogical fool, etc.
In any case, experience must be interpreted correctly. Your interpretation of your experience may not be
always true. Your own experience is meaningless unless you interpret it in the context of what you consider
you know based on your belief system, paradigm, memes, presupposition, framework, and philosophy of
life. Of course, your present posteriori knowledge has also been introduced to you through, or you based it
on, your previous experiences which you have also interpreted by what you “know” at that time in the
context of your belief system, etc. Without doubt, it is a cycle of knowledge-belief-experience which forms
a long chain of reaction as long as you live by interacting in the world in which you live. But the questions
that you must answer are: what is your basis of understanding your personal experience? How can you
know that your framework of interpretation, criteria or adequate test for truth are not false, wrong, or
deceived? I repeat, you cannot really answer the questions I gave to you unless you assumed Bible truth.
You assumed it in order to live but you reject it in your belief-system which is an expression of
inconsistency and deception. The Bible is true because Jesus is the true truth, He alone is the Truth of
truths!
-------------- - --------------------------------------
36
#104 ~∞~
Posted by Mystic In Response to #103 “One cannot be exposed to the law
SHUT UP! I TOLD YOU THIS CONVERSATION and order of the universe without
WAS OVER. WHY ARE YOU STILL TALKING TO concluding that there must be design
ME? YOU CANNOT UNDERSTAND ME, AND
THATS FINE. IM DONE TALKING TO YOU. LIVE and purpose behind it all....
WITH YOUR LIMITED VISION OF THE UNIVERSE. The better we understand the
I DONT CARE. DON’T HEAR ME. I DONT CARE. intricacies of the universe and all it
WE ARE THROUGH. DONE. THIS IS THE END. DO
NOT PASS GO. DO NOT COLLECT $200. GO TO harbors, the more reason we have
CHURCH, READ YOUR BIBLE, AND DONT LIVE found to marvel at the inherent
WITH GOD, JUST READ ABOUT ITS
EXPERIENCES. WHEN YOU HAVE MATURED TO
design upon which it is based....
THE POINT THAT WE CAN COMMUNICATE To be forced to believe only one
MATURELY, WE WILL DO SO. UNTIL THEN, DO conclusion—that everything in the
NOT REPLY TO ME. ONCE AGAIN, LEAVE ME THE
HELL ALONE. HAVE A NICE DAY.
universe happened by chance—would
-------------- - --------------- violate the very objectivity of science
#105 itself.... What random process could
Posted by Biblical Christian In Response to produce the brains of man or the
#104 system of the human eye?
“Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that They (evolutionists) challenge science
put darkness for light, and light for darkness; that put to prove the existence of God. But
bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter! Woe unto them that
are wise in their own eyes, and prudent in their own
must we really light a candle to see
sight!” (Isaiah 5:20-21) the sun? ...They say they cannot
“There is a way which seemeth right unto a man, but the visualize a designer. Well, can a
end thereof are the ways of death.” (Proverbs 14:12)
“Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the physicist visualize an electron?
life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.” (John ...What strange rationale makes some
14:6) physicists accept the inconceivable
“Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none
other name under heaven given among men, whereby we electron as real while refusing to
must be saved.” (Acts 4:12) accept the reality of a Designer on the
“For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is
eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.” (Romans
ground that they cannot
6:23) conceive Him?.”
-------------- - --------------- – Dr. Werner von Braun, quoted by Dennis R.
Petersen, Unlocking the Mysteries of Creation,
#106 Vol. 1 (El Cajon: Master Books, 1988), p. 63.
Posted by Mystic In Response to #105 ~∞~
ARE YOU DUMB? I TOLD YOU NOT TO REPLY.
NOT AT ALL. HOW MANY WAYS DO I HAVE TO TELL YOU TO SCREW OFF? I AM SICK OF
YOUR NONSENSE AND CRAP. WHEN I WANT TO HEAR BIBLE QUOTES, I WILL READ THEM
OR ASK FOR THEM. LEAVE ME ALONE.
-------------- - --------------------------------------
#107
(No One Answered)
Bible truth is not nonsense. True truth is not nonsense. Everything makes sense when seen in the light of
the Truth of truths: the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.
-------------- - --------------------------------------
37
#108
Posted by Professing Christian In Response to #92
Perhaps “skeptical” was the wrong word. I don’t think I am a skeptic, I am instead an analyzer. I have been
alkalizing Christian beliefs as much as I can to reveal any inconsistencies. If certain Bible interpretations
directly contradicts the evidence we have gathered, then they are wrong. Such is the case with the creation
of the world. This obviously didn’t happen in seven days, but if the Bible is interpreted symbolically, it
becomes evident that the “days” represent a certain period in the creation of the earth. This description
given at the beginning of the Bible is very similar to most scientist’s theories. First there was nothing, then
there were plants, then fish, then mammals, then man, etc. Although some things are quite obviously out of
place, (the moon is created after animals) it mostly accurate. This “seven days” discription contradicts the
one given directly after. The next chapter describes God creating man, then animals, then woman. I am
inclined to disregard this completely, although I believe it is to some extent true in a spiritual sense. There
are many regulars at this site who will disagree with me, but I believe that people are free willed, and
following from this as detailed in previous postings, they have a “supernatural” quality. This is commonly
called the soul among Christians. In the sense that all beings whose actions are predetermined do not exist
as thinking beings, there were no real beings until humans. I know the others are going to jump all over me
for this, but this is how both desriptions of creation can coexist. Thus, Christians should not oppose
evolution, but they should instead argue that this evolution was STARTED by God and that the neandretals
were not people as we are because unlike us, their actions were predetermined. At this site, many of us
have been arguing the free will vs. determinism delimma for a long time. Many of these postings are still
here, if you want to read them.
There do exist definite inconsistencies in the Bible. For example, God is described as being perfect, but
often in the prophetic books God is described as being angry. How can a perfect being have anger, which is
one of the seven deadly sins? For this reason, I disregard the idea of God having wrath or any other defect.
I would also like to say that I did not mean to suggest that more should be added to the Bible. I meant that
all Christians should familiarize themselves with the church’s history, writings, and ideas over the past
2000 years in a similar way that they read the Bible. I’m not saying they should regard it as sacred text, but
it can just as useful as some parts of the bible.
-------------- - --------------------------------------
#109
(Answered by Christian Two at #110 and by Professing Christian at #111)
Churchianity is not Christianity. Evolution is not Creation. Babble is not Bible. You must thoroughly
study the Bible in all its detail (grammatically, historically, contextually, etc.) prayerfully before you can
see its beautiful harmony and perfection. Just by reading or listening to those deluded fool who criticized
the Bible who think that they are more wiser than God Himself is utter foolishness. To correct an opinion
by your own opinion is nothing but opinionated opinion. You must have adequate test, ultimate criterion,
final authority, of truth. The Bible is true because Jesus is the true truth, He alone is the Truth of truths!
-------------- - --------------------------------------
#110
Posted by Christian Two In Response to #109
(No One Answered)
Hey, I like what you said about the Bible being the ultimate criterion of “spiritual” truth.
-------------- - --------------------------------------
______________
#110 Angel Diaz the Christian Two is wrong here when he wrote that the Bible is ultimate criterion only in the realm of
spiritual truth. Does it mean that the Bible cannot be used to serve as ultimate criterion in the intellectual and physical
truths? Read Psa.12:6-7 and 2 Tim.3:16-17. From the opening pages of the Bible (Genesis 1) to the final pages of the
Bible (Revelation 21), it is very clear that it stand as the ultimate standard/criterion of all things: physical, intellectual
and spiritual. “Casting down imaginations, and every high thing that exalteth itself against the knowledge of God, and
bringing into captivity every thought to the obedience of Christ” (2 Cor.10:5).
38
~∞~
#111
“My Lord God, my all in all,
(Answered by Atheist at #112 and by Biblical Christian at #114) life of my life, and spirit of my
Periander, I have read some of your banterous postings in the past, spirit, look in mercy upon me
but this time you direct your anger against me. I read this message
and I don’t understand what I could possibly learn from it. You and so fill me with Thy Holy
start out by saying “Churchianity is not Christianity”, which makes Spirit that my heart shall have
no sense. You then for some reason say “Evolution is not no room for love of aught but
Creation”. If you read my posting, you will see that I have given a
theory on how evolution and creation can both be correct. There Thee. I seek from Thee no other
was evolution, but this was started by God. I also said that gift but Thyself, who art the
evolution happened in a PHYSICAL sense and creation happened
in a SPIRITUAL sense. I have seen you website, and you attemp
Giver of life and all its
to disprove evolution scientifically. This is insane, because all blessings. From Thee I ask not
physical evidence leads to evolution. You do not seem understand for the world or its treasures,
the difference between the body and the soul. Physically, you are
flesh and blood, but spiritually, you are a soul. It is irrelevant if nor yet for heaven even make
people PHYSICALLY evolved from apes, because we were request, but Thee alone do I
SPIRITUALLY created by God. This is not said in the Bible this desire and long for, and where
way because the way the Bible explains it is effectively the same,
think about it! Thou art there is Heaven. The
“Just by reading or listening to those deluded fool who criticized hunger and the thirst of this
the Bible who think that they are more wiser than God Himself is heart of mine can be satisfied
utter foolishness.”
I will read and listen to anyone and everyone I want because I want only with Thee who hast given
to broaden my mind. It is also unwise for you to insult anybody at it birth. O Creator mine!
this site, that is not what we do here. If you have a problem with Thou hast created my heart for
somebody’s views, simply EXPLAIN why they are wrong, do not
insult them or write long meaningless messages to them. You Thyself alone, and not for
should be able to understand what is effective in getting your point another, therefore this my heart
across, and you should understand what does nothing but annoys
people.
can find no rest or ease save in
“To correct an opinion by your own opinion is nothing but Thee, in Thee who hast both
opinionated opinion.” created it and set in it this very
If you are going to respond to me again, I strongly suggest it does longing for rest. Take away
not contain nonsense like this. You should realize that I am
defending spirituality, God, and religion here. I am trying to then from my heart all that is
present this argument as best I can, and I am trying to use logic to opposed to Thee, and enter and
do it. abide and rule for ever. Amen.”
I must ask you a question, what is the truth? You will of course say
– Sadhu Sundar Singh, At the Master’s
Jesus, the bible, etc. But then I will inform you that there are Feet, London: Fleming H. Revell Co.,
hundreds of groups all over the world, and all of them are certain 1922, pp. 4-5.
they have the truth. How then do you show someone who does not
have the truth that yours is the “true truth”? The answer is logic,
~∞~
reason, explaining things to people. If the Bible is the truth, then it
should be possible to construct all of its essential ideas through reason. Reason has to be inherently good
because if it were bad, then a perfect person would be one who doesn’t think.
-------------- - --------------------------------------
______________
#111 Brandon the Professing Christian mistakenly assumed that evolution is true based on his opinion and then built
most of his dogma on evolution. In other words, like other infidels, his belief-system is founded on lies and deception.
39
#112
Good post to Periander. This type of post is most unfortunate. A few posts ago he accepted his “mea
culpa” when he was getting in Twist’s face. Stilll again Periander loses the essence of what we try to do
here. I think I also tried to warn you when I said, “Now you’ve done it!
Yes, whatever our respective opinions, we try to explain our points of view, not repeat the “Jesus is the true
truth” slogan as a parrot says “Arrhhh, Poly wants a cracker” in substitution of honest discussion.
Periander, if you want to preach the gospel, find but do it on your own site. That’s what you have it for,
don’t you?
-------------- - --------------------------------------
#113
(No One Answered)
im getting to like you more and more all the time louis.
-------------- - --------------------------------------
#114
(Answered by Professing Christian at #115)
If what I have told you about the truth is just nonsense in your own opinionated opinion, I cannot do
anything about it. Just one more reminder, don’t be fooled by unbelieving conviction espoused by atheists,
critics, skeptics, and new agers; you must believed the Truth of truths, He is the Lord and Saviour Jesus
Christ. You assumed Bible truth in order to live but you reject it with your belief-system injected to you by
infidels. Jesus is the true truth! Read John 3:16; Matthew 11:28; Ephesians 2:8-10; Jeremiah 29:11;
Proverbs 3:5-7; Psalms 37:1-5; Romans 3:23; 6:23; 10:9-10.
-------------- - --------------------------------------
#115
I did request that you not reply with nonsense, and when I said that I meant phrases like “opinionated
opinion” and “true truth”. Any opinion is opinionated and any truth is true, so it is unnecessary to say
things that way. And I never doubted anything about Jesus, make sure that only you argue against the
things that I have actually written.
“You assumed Bible truth in order to live but you reject it with your belief-system injected to you by
infidels.”
Nothing is ‘injected’ in me, I make up my own mind and I am searching for the truth. I wish I could say
the same about you.
One more thing, the bible does explicitly say that God loves everyone. Knowing this, God should welcome
anyone to heaven who wants to go there and follows his laws. These are the naturally uccuring ethical laws
that all people should be expected to figure out on their own. Of course, the church emphiseses faith for
salvation, which makes sense. This is because one does not have to act ethically, just as long as they
repent. But I don’t think this works completely because some people use this as an excuse to sin because
they know they can repent later, ethics therefore are essential. And it would not make sense for someone
who knowingly rejects god to enter heaven. But what about all the people who have never heard of God or
heaven? What about all the people in China, do they go to hell simply because nobody ever told them the
truth? This cannot be, because it contradicts our assumption that God loves all people. Therefore, the
meaning of life is to act ethically as much as possible and to genuinely repent for the sake of understanding
ones failing and to try not to repeat the same mistake. People can achieve salvation without believing in
God if they have never heard of God or if it makes sense to them that there is no God, provided they act
ethically.
-------------- - --------------------------------------
40
#116 ~∞~
Posted by Biblical Christian In Response to #115 “Christian maturity cannot fully
(Answered by Professing Christian at #117)
You cannot used a text of the Bible out of its context just to take place, however, unless we are
justify what you believed even if it contradicts all other parts of free in Christ. When people aren’t
the Scripture. You start by believing in Creation SCIENCE but
you connected it with Evolution THEORY; you start by citing free in Christ they go from book to
the BIBLE about the love of God but you continue by reasoning book, from pastor to pastor, and
out of your BELIEF-SYSTEM without considering what the from counselor to counselor, but
entire Bible tells about it. Read Romans 1, Acts 17, Colossians
and 1 Corithians 15 if you are looking for answers about your nothing seems to work. Watch how
questions. The word “opinionated opinion” and “true truth” is fast they can grow, however,
not nonsense if you will only try to understand these terms.
Opinionated opinion refers to the miserable uncertainty of those
when they are free in Christ!”
– Neil T. Anderson, A Way of Escape, Eugene:
who do not have adequate test, ultimate criterion, and inerrant
Harvest House Publishers, 1994, p. 167.
standard of truth. Thus, naturally, in this forum no one can really
tell the true truth if they have no absolute basis to tell them what ~∞~
is real truth; only what they consider “truth” in their own
opinion, which they are not certain at all if it is truth indeed, are what they are trying to express but they
cannot point others’ position as either right or wrong, truth or deception, or true or false; not that they held
no beliefs about truth but what they hold as “truth” is no better than what others also considered “truth” in
their own opinions. I repeat, to correct the opinions of others by another opinion is nothing but opinionated
opinion. Jesus is the true truth!
-------------- - --------------------------------------
#117
I don’t understand why you say that my use of logic in religious matters can be wrong. Reason cannot be
wrong, because if it were there would have to be a reason why, which is a contradiction. And I don’t
understand why you think it is impossible for anything in the Bible to be incorrect. There are many things
that everybody should know that are not in the Bible, and some parts of the Bible are completely useless. I
am not a Bible expert, but I do recall reading in one of Paul’s letters something close to “if the first
covenant was without flaw then there would be no need for a second covenant”.
And I would really like for you to explain how evolution is wrong in a physical sense. Your insistance on
this is ridiculous, you obviously still do not understand the difference between physicality and spirituality.
You seem to think that 99% of the world is going to hell. From what you have written, it seems that to get
into heaven, one has to believe that everything in the Bible is completely correct (Don’t get me wrong, I
think most of it is correct). But it makes much more sense that most people in the world achieve this
because God would not create people if nearly all of them will go to hell simply because they don’t have
complete blind faith.
-------------- - --------------------------------------
#118
Periander, I sure hope it’s St. Peter at the Gates of Heaven and not someone like you there deciding who
enters and who goes to hell. Be careful Periander, you are being judgmental, probably more mental than
judge.
-------------- - --------------------------------------
______________
#117 All infidels are totally ignorant of the fact that reason, logic, sanity, evidence, proof, etc. can only consistently
exist in the Judeo-Christian worldview. Light, life and love exist only because of the Bible truth.
41
#119
(No One Answered)
The person himself decides whether he want to go to heaven or to hell. God will not force anyone to go to
heaven if they don’t want to go to it by rejecting God’s invitation to them through the Lord and Saviour
Jesus Christ alone. To judge a person to be judgmental is judgmentality. God is the only Judge of judges.
-------------- - --------------------------------------
#120
(Answered by Atheist at #121 and by Professing Christian at #123)
Reason is useful if is governed by the Bible, the perfect Word of God. But if reason is governed by the
depravity, imperfection and fraily of man, it is useless. What kind of logic did you used in religious
matters? There are different kinds of “reasons” which you can use depending upon the belief-system in
which it is based. Even irrationalism is considered by some to be the highest reason for it is beyond it.
Thus, you must have a firm basis to know whether what you consider as logic or reason is not illogical and
unreasonable. Is your reason inerrant and infallible so that you can use it to judge even the Bible which is
the very Word of God? There are those who think they are smart enough to correct the Bible truth which
they assumed as long as they live. Reason, logic, experience, perception, commonsense, etc. assumed
Bible truth to be truly workable and livable. If you will assumed, by contradicting Bible truth, that this
world is not real but just a product of whim and imagination, that it is illusion (“maya”), that it has no
order, no laws which governed it and our mind, that all things are full of chaos governed by chance, that
there is no agreement of perception, that there is no subject-object correlation, that our mind is not reliable
and able to understand the reality, causality and unity of the universe, etc. you cannot live and give reason
at all. On the contrary, you really assumed Bible truth but you reject its inerrancy as a whole due to
inconsistency based on your belief-system which does not originally came out from yourself but just a
product of indoctrination whether by reading books or by listening to other human being like you, etc. For
instance, evolution, where did this theory originate which contradicted the Creation account of the Bible?
It is purely a product of man’s illusion and Satanic deception. It is destitute of any evidence. All the laws
of science and reason were contradicted by evolution as partly shown by my article SCIENTISM published
in my website. It is admitted by all evolutionists that there are MISSING LINKS, there are no evolutionary
links (the would-be major proofs of evolution) in the fossil record (historically) and even in the observable
phenomena of today (scientifically). Indeed, this so-called “missing link” is really the brainchild of the
pregnant imagination and deception of Darwin and evolutionists to supply their theory by evidence which
does not exist. Until now, they are still looking in vain for such links to fill up the existing clear-cut gaps
between primitive plants and modern plants, between eukaryotes and prokaryotes, between unicellular
organisms and multicellular animals, between invertebrates and fish, between fish and amphibians, between
amphibians and reptiles, between reptiles and mammals, between land mammals and sea mammals,
between non-flying mammals and bats, between apes and human beings. For the meantime, evolutionists
faithfully based their ideas of evolution in the “geologic column” which is nothing but based on the
fallacious reasoning of circularity. They based the fossil “sequences” on the geologic “ages”, the geologic
“ages” on fossil “evolutionary stages”, and the fossil “evolutionary stages” on the fossil “sequences”. Thus,
evolutionists today, if you do not know, were academically divided into two camps of monkey-man: the
Dawkinians (neo-Darwinists) who believed in the slow, gradual evolutionary change, and the Gouldians
(Punctuated-equilibriumists) who believed in the rapid, abrupt transformation of species. No surprise, the
one attacked the other by following the Darwinian creed: “survival of the fittest”. The former pointed out
that it is genetically improbable for evolution to take place rapidly through the quantum leap of speciation.
But the latter pointed out that it is paleontologically undemonstrable for evolution to take place slowly
through mutation by natural selection. In fact, both refutations are correct as proved by evidences from
biochemistry and paleontology: evolution is really impossible to take place at all. There is no scientific
evidence for evolution; all are mere assumptions and misconceptions. Creation science, on the other hand,
is well supported by scientific evidences (biochemistry, genetics, geology, paleontology, physics, biology,
etc.). There are no links between species but there is indeed missing link between God and man because of
the sin-gap which began in our original ancestor (Adam and Eve) when they disobeyed their Creator, the
Lord God. We need the God-Man Jesus Christ, both Creator and creation are one in Him (1 Tim.2:5-6;
3:16). You don’t need the ape-men to explain the meaning of your life for there is no such thing. Apes are
42
always apes, men are always men but there is no ape-man:

hoax – Piltdown man, pig‘s tooth – Nebraska man, lost –
~∞~
Peking man, composite of man and gibbon – Java man, “In I Corinthians 2:16 Paul says
diseased man – Neanderthal, etc. You need the God-Man, not ‘we have the mind of Christ.’
the ape-man, to save you from sin and death. Don’t allow
yourself to devolve into hell, repent now and believe in the
The word is nous. How is it
Lord Jesus Christ as your personal Saviour. Jesus is the true possible for us to have Christ’s
truth. He will judge all men at the end and He is the Supreme, nous, unless his mind is the
perfect Judge without any injustices, all will be judged
according to the light which they received, no one is excused, truth? We have Christ’s mind
there is no unfair judgment that will be given by the insofar as we think his thoughts.
omnipotent, omnipresent and omniscient God of all, the Judge Of course we are not omniscient;
of judges.
-------------- - ------------------ we do not think all his thoughts;
#121 and worse, we think some false
Posted by Atheist In Response to #120 propositions too. We are what
(Answered by Biblical Christian at #122) we think, just as Christ is what
If the Bible is the “very Word of God”, god should have
written it himself in his own handwriting and not in the he thinks. His doctrine or
imperfect, “depravity, imperfection and frail(t)y of man”’s teaching saves us from eternal
handwriting. In fact, the Bible describes god’s only attempt at
writing in his own penmanship on the slabs of rock Moses
death (John 8:51). He is the
brought down form Mount Sinai. Must have pissed him off truth! Is this not what scripture
because Moses slamned and broke the original copy then God teaches? Christ is the Logos, his
had to write them up a second time. By the way, maybe there
were more than ten commandments but Moses could only
rhemata are truth; he is God’s
carry the first ten down the mountain without breaking them. wisdom; and I Samuel 2:3 says
I wonder what the other ones were about. Also, too bad that that ‘the Lord is a God
even the copy was lost with the Ark of the Covenant
somewhere in the desert. Indiana Jones where are you? of knowledge.’”
Lighten up Periander! – Gordon H. Clark, God’s Hammer: The
Bible and Its Critics, Jefferson: The Trinity
-------------- - ------------------ Foundation, 1987, p. 185.
#122 ~∞~
(No One Answered)
Only God is absolutely perfect. Every thing which He had made in the beginning was very good
(Gen.1:31). It was relatively perfect. What makes it very bad and imperfect today is due to man’s
disobedience to God’s word by following Satan’s word (Gen.3). But God can restore His creation as He
had done through the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ alone as revealed in the Bible. The Bible is the word
of God written in the purified language of man (Psa.12:6,7) written by holy men of God as guided by the
Holy Spirit (2 Pet.1:20,21; 2 Tim3:16). The Bible is true because Jesus is the true truth, He alone is the
Truth of truths.
-------------- - --------------------------------------
#123
That was all very interesting, your explanation of how evolution is not supported by evidence. You are very
stern in your opposition to evolution. The Bible clearly says that people were created by God, and anyone
who believes in God must acknowledge this. But once again you have failed to see the main point of this.
You failed to see that it is irrelevant if we are the physical decendents of apes if our souls came directly
from God. You believe that there is a non-physical aspect of humans, don’t you? Of course you do, you
are not flesh, blood, DNA, bones, and organs, you are a free willed soul who receives senses from this body
and controls its actions. You are not the body, as the Bible says, the body is “a temple of the holy spirit”,
the body and the soul are unattached. Why then does it matter so much the purely physical ancestery of the
43
body? I suppose it is true that nobody knows for sure if evolution is true, but the main point I am trying to
make is that it really doesn’t matter, and it does not contradict the Bible.
In the beginning of Genisis, there is an obvious contradiction, or so it seems at first. Which came first, man
or animals? The “seven days” discription says that animals came first, then people. The other discription
says that Adam was first, then the animal, then Eve. I’m sure you and all of your Bible expert friends have
come up with an explination for this, but I’ll bet it is wrong. The first account is a symbolic discription of
evolution, the purely physical history of humans. The second is spiritual explination. Adam’s body
already existed, but there was no soul until God created it. Nothing physical exists beyond perception, the
only thing that really exists is the free willed perceiver. Thus, the animals didn’t exist in this sense until
Adam had seen them, and this explains why they came after him in the second discription.
These are just ideas, possibilities demonstrating how both our evidence of evolution and the Bible can both
be right. Denying the accuracy of evolutionary evidence will do nothing but alienate religion, and do
nothing positive. You should realize that evolution did happen in a physical sense and that this constant
debate is meaningless because it is not relevant to the human soul.
-------------- - --------------------------------------
#124
(No One Answered)
As you have seen, evolution has no single scientific proof to support it so we must not even include it in the
study of sciences. It is presented as a “theory” but it has no single fact that it can explain to be accounted
even as a theory. Evolution exists only as a word and as an idea in the minds of those who believed in it, it
is a fairy tale for grown-up, it has no objective reality. To use evolution, which cannot be found both in the
Bible (the words of God: special revelation of God) and in nature (the works of God: general revelation of
God) as an explanation for the meaning of life is not only misleading but also totally deceiving. You must
not used lies and deception to explain anything, let alone the human being. The whole man is not the body,
nor the spirit, nor the soul but both body, soul and spirit. The body (for world-consciousness), the soul (for
self-consciousness) and the spirit (for God-consciousness) makes the whole man (1 Thess.5:23). The
perceiver, the perceived, and the perception exist only because of God, the Reality of realities, as revealed
in the Bible. Jesus is the true truth.
-------------- - --------------------------------------
NOTE TO THE READER:
This is the end of the chronicles. It is like a long journey where you met different
kinds of people like in John Bunyan’s “Pilgrim’s Progress”. You can add notes to
the margin of this book if you want to. Interact with it, reread it, and expand your
knowledge and wisdom (Col.2:2-3) toward an effective defense of Christianity
against the subtil attacks of infidels. I pray that God had used this book to edify
you. What I have posted here are my thoughts eight years ago but as you can
see in my annotations, I’m consistent until now; I have never changed an iota of
my firm belief to God’s word and my rational faith to the Lord and Saviour Jesus
Christ (2 Tim.1:7). In fact, it becomes stronger than it was. The more I study
science, philosophy and religion, the more I see the absolute perfection of God
and His words. But don’t ever look at me, look only to Jesus (Heb.12:2). I have
my own sins, failures, mistakes, and errors. I’m not perfect but Jesus is perfect.
Trust only in Him. He will never leave you nor forsake you. He will not even
failed you. When all else fails, look unto Him. He is the only true and real
meaning of our life. Only God’s love can fulfill and satisfy your life (Jn.3:16; Rom.
5:1-5). The Bible is true because Jesus is the true truth; He alone is the Truth of
truths!!! (Jn.14:6; 8:12; 6:63; 1 Cor.15:1-4)
44
THE LORD AND SAVIOUR JESUS CHRIST IN EVERY BOOK OF THE BIBLE
GENESIS . . . . . Creator and Seed of the woman
EXODUS . . . Passover Lamb
LEVITICUS . . . High Priest
NUMBERS . . . . . Pillar of Cloud
DEUTERONOMY . . . . . . Prophet Like unto Moses
JOSHUA . . . . Captain of Our Salvation
JUDGES . . . . Judge and Lawgiver
RUTH . . . . . Kinsmen and Redeemer
I & II SAMUEL . . . . Trusted Prophet
I & II KINGS and I & II CHRONICLES . . . Reigning King
EZRA . . . . . Faithful Scribe
NEHEMIAH. . . . . Rebuilder of the broken walls
ESTHER . . . The One who came in due Time
JOB . . . . Everlasting Redeemer
PSALMS. . . . . Our Shepherd
PROVERBS and ECCLESIASTES. . . . Our Wisdom
SONG OF SOLOMON . . . . Rose of Sharon and the Lily of The Valley
.ISAIAH. . . . Prince of Peace
JEREMIAH and LAMENTATIONS. . . . Weeping Prophet
EZEKIEL . . . . Watchman on the Wall
DANIEL . . . . Fourth Man in the Fire
HOSEA . . . . Faithful Husband
JOEL . . . . Baptizer with the Holy Spirit
AMOS. . . . . Our Burden-Bearer
OBADIAH . . . . Our Deliverance
JONAH . . . . Our Foreign Missionary
MICAH . . . . Our Eternal Saviour Born in Bethlehem
NAHUM . . . . . Our Avenger
HABAKKUK . . . . . Our Evangelist Pleading for Revival
ZEPHANIAH . . . . The Lord Mighty in Judgment
HAGGAI . . . . . The Builder of the Temple
ZECHARIAH . . . . Our Fountain Opened and In the House of David
MALACHI . . . . Our Messenger of Jehovah
MATTHEW. . . . King
MARK. . . . Servant
LUKE . . . . Son of Man
JOHN . . . Immanuel the Son of God
ACTS. . . . . The Holy Spirit at Work in His People
ROMANS. . . . . . Justifier
I & II CORINTHIANS . . . . . . Sanctifier
GALATIANS . . . Redeemer from the Curse of the Law
EPHESIANS . . . . Giver of Spiritual Gifts
PHILIPPIANS . . . . God Who Supplies Every Need
COLOSSIANS . . . . The Fulness of the Godhead Bodily
I & II THESSALONIANS. . . . . Soon Coming King
I & II TIMOTHY. . . . . Mediator Between God and Man
TITUS. . . . . . . Blessed Hope
PHILEMON . . . . Account Settler
HEBREWS. . . . .Blood of the Everlasting Covenant
JAMES. . . . Perfect Law of Liberty
I & II PETER . . . . Chief Shepherd
I & II & III JOHN . . . .Commandment of Love
JUDE . . . . . Lord Coming with Ten Thousand Saints
REVELATION . . . . . . King of Kings and Lord of lords
45
THE REASON THAT I LIVE

(Words and Music by Periander A. Esplana)
Everytime I bow down, I look up to You in my heart

All I pray is to have the love of God the Son
Jesus the Light, Jesus the Life, Jesus the Love of loves
And I’ll give all to You my life

And I’ll give all to You my heart
And I’ll give all to You my mind
And I’ll give all to You everything in me
All my strength is all for You

All my soul is all for You
All my heart is all for You
You are the Reason that I live
Jesus is the reason of my life

Jesus is the reason of my heart
Jesus is the reason of my mind
JESUS THE REASON THAT I LIVE
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THE

God Shall Reveal Even This Unto You

11 If by any means I might attain unto the resurrection of the dead.

15 Let us therefore, as many as be perfect, be thus minded: and if in any thing ye be

- Paul the Apostle of the Gentiles

THE MEANING OF LIFE

Eight years ago, I joined and participated in an on-line forum/debate at

Cosmos Chat Participants/Discussants/Debaters on the Meaning of Life:

Let me briefly refute and criticize each dogma:

always apes, men are always men but there is no ape-man:

NOTE TO THE READER:

THE REASON THAT I LIVE

Everytime I bow down, I look up to You in my heart

And I’ll give all to You my life

All my strength is all for You

Jesus is the reason of my life

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