Women Catholic Deacons 'No Longer Taboo'

Women Catholic deacons 'no longer taboo' - The Local
30/04/13 08:00
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Women Catholic deacons 'no longer taboo'

Published: 29 Apr 13 11:32 CET | Print version Online: http://www.thelocal.de/society/20130429-49427.html
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Germany's top Roman Catholic has called for women to be allowed to become deacons, which would enable them to perform baptisms and marriages outside of mass - a novelty for Catholic women.
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30/04/13 08:00
Archbishop of Freiburg Robert Zollitsch, who chairs the German Bishops' Conference, called for the change at the end of a four-day meeting to discuss possible reforms. The conference, the first of its kind, invited 300 Roman Catholic experts to propose reforms. Zollitsch's comments echo year-long calls from the Central Committee of German Catholics to permit women to become deacons. On Sunday, Zollitsch said that aim was no longer a 'taboo.' Zollitsch said the Catholic Church could only regain credibility and strength by committing to reform. He described an "atmosphere of openness and freedom" at the conference. Deacons assist priests during church services and can perform baptisms and marriages outside of mass. Their primary role however is to serve the needy in their community and their duties are considered secular rather than pastoral. Another proposal to emerge from the conference was to extend the rights of remarried divorcees to sit on church bodies such as parish councils. Conference members also discussed the possibility of granting them the right to receive Holy Communion and attend confession. "It's important to me that, without undermining the sanctity of marriage, these men and women are taken seriously within the church and feel respected and at home," said Zollitsch. At present the reforms remain speculative and there is no proposed time-frame for their implementation. The position of divorcees remains highly controversial within the Church. The conference also touched on the difficulty, particularly in eastern Germany, of recruiting people to work for Catholic institutions such as hospitals and kindergarten. At present the Church can only employ Roman Catholics. However Zollitsch called for work permits to be extended to non-Catholics and to those with "different lifestyles." This would technically apply to homosexual people too. However Church labour reforms are unlikely to be introduced in the next three years. While reform might be slow to come, the sentiments expressed at the conference are a signal to many that change is on the way. "I have never experienced a process of strategy development as transparent as this one," said Thomas Berg, of the Baden-Wrttemberg Leadership Academy, who attended the conference. DPA/The Local/kkf
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Show 2 New Comments Tony Esolen
a day ago
A slow suicide pill. Would the Church make the same case for bigamists being "respected," or pornographers? We don't go to Church because we are respectable. We go to Church because we are sinners. If you want "respect," the world will give you plenty -- to your undoing. As for deaconesses, if you want to clear out the last young men from the Church, go for it. See how well it has worked in the Anglican Church.
59 3 Reply Share
Tony Esolen 21 hours ago
athelstane
Slow suicide, indeed. It's fairly obvious that the goal in view is women priests, not just deacons. This will (by design) only help to accustom Catholics to the idea of women clergy. Which, after all, is what deacons are - they receive holy orders. Once you concede one
30/04/13 08:00
after all, is what deacons are - they receive holy orders. Once you concede one holy order, how you can you deny the others? Many of the German bishops are clearly desperate for relevance in a secularizing society. They don't seem to realize that "relevance" is a sure trip to ecclesiastical death. Ask the Protestant churches in Germany who ordain women how it's working out for them.
31 1 Reply Share
athelstane 20 hours ago
Greg Colley
That the goal is women priests is not obvious in the slightest. Are you familiar with the distinct difference between the diaconate and priesthood that has been developing in church law over the last couple of decades? It is a recognition that women are the ones serving in the church right now, and as a result, they deserve the same recognition they received in the early church -- ordination as deacons. Those who are working in pastoral ministry know precisely the need for more ordained deacons, especially with the expanded ability to provide the sacrament of the sick (which is not currently possible). This is not about a political agenda, it is about ministry.
2 5 Reply Share
Greg Colley 18 hours ago
Michael Pigg
Only priests can perform the Anointing of the Sick, so more deacons, male or female, will not help in this area.
14 Greg Colley Reply Share
Michael Pigg 15 hours ago
I provide pastoral care in hospitals, and anointing is one spiritual service where the lack of qualified ministers is terribly acute. Allowing deacons to perform the anointing is actually more complicated that ordaining women as deacons. I hope both are considered, and as regards anointing, I know many priests who would argue in favor of allowing deacons to perform the rite.
2 3 Reply Share
bonaventure
One diocese in Germany (which, btw, has proven to be a total failure) cannot try to dictate to the universal Church. The Church's teaching on ordination does not belong to a diocese. It belongs to the entire Church. Oh, and you seem to totally fail to address the "different lifestyles" mention by this bishop. I am sure you'll try to spin it. Wonder if you'll spin it well enough to include pedophilia? You know, the up and
30/04/13 08:00
spin it well enough to include pedophilia? You know, the up and coming thing after sodomy.
4 Reply Share
John Rayner
Anointing of the sick also forgives sin when a person is unable to make oral confession. Only priests have the power to forgive sin. It is therefore out of the question for deacons to administer the sacrament.
2 Reply Share
Michael Pigg 14 minutes ago
Christine Sorensen
That is true and horribly sad. As a Pastoral Minister I know too well the chaos of a stream of phone calls trying to find a priest to do an anointing in an emergency. People often die without the sacrament they or their family have requested... This is a too sad reality.
Reply JefZeph Share
We don't even need to look as far as Anglicanism. Examine the effects of Altar girls, and that tells us all we need to know. Regarding deaconesses, it seems congruous with "civil unions', in that its acceptance will only serve as a stepping stone. We know with certainty that those who push for it will never be satisfied with just being a humble deacon.
9 2 Reply Share
JefZeph 17 hours ago
bzeealbub
What effects of girls are you referring too? At my parish even with a grade school attached boys did not want to serve at all of the masses. When given the chance several young ladies stepped up to SERVE.
3 Joris Heise 2 Reply Share
If it is of God, it is the right thing. The task of the church--hierarchy and laity--is to discern the will of the Father--not just keep doing things the way they have always been done, nor jump into modern newfangledness. Not destroy the law, but fulfill it...if deaconesses are what God has called for, then it is the right thing, whether your or like want it or not. If the church changes to be "respectable," then that would be a sin, of course (see the Sermon on the Mount); but if it changes to obey what is discerned as the Will of God--well, the church had better change!
6 2 Reply Share
Pgina 5 de 22
30/04/13 08:00
Greg Colley
Tony, read up on your history of women deacons and deaconesses. Two different ministries, historically speaking (and distinct from "widows" and "virgins" as well). And don't try to blame "women in ministry" for young people questioning their Christian vocation. I would suggest that the tone of "exclusivity" and structures of male domination don't reflect their experience in life, and hence they fail to see the relevance of the church. Thanks for helping on that point, by the way. And I personally have a completely different understanding of what "respect" means in this context: it means being made to feel welcome. If we are all sinners, then the pastoral mission of the church ought to be opening wide the doors to the process of transformation. We should "welcome" the divorced, the bigamists, and the pornographers -- as well as the close minded and patronizing -- so that all can work towards grace.
2 5 Reply Share
Magdalene Prodigal
"transform"? Into the mess that the episcopal and Lutheran churches are in? I do hope you are not a Catholic Franciscan with this attitude.
10 Reply Greg Colley Share
Magdalene Prodigal 19 hours ago
Transforming people and their hearts away from sin and towards a Gospel form of life. Was there another pastoral mission were you thinking of?
2 3 Reply Share
Michael Pigg
Confirming them in sin is not pastoral and surely not transforming.

Michael Pigg 15 hours ago
So, you are saying that to welcome sinners into Church is confirming them in sin? Can you explain? Does this mean that the best way to transform sinners is to deny them access to the sacraments? Could you clarify?
3 3 Reply Share
John Rayner
Sinners are always welcome into the Church, starting with them confessing their sins and attempting to sin no more. After they have received the sacrament of reconciliation they can, as we all can, go on to receive other sacraments.
30/04/13 08:00
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John Rayner 8 hours ago
Rudy Auerbach
A lot of insecure men here afraid to allow women their rightful place as equals before God.
1 Christine Sorensen 2 Reply Share
Tony Esolen 12 minutes ago
I do not get why when women get to be in a position that men leave that position. Why do they clear out?
Reply Fisherman
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21 hours ago
Didn't another German cleric try to reform the Catholic Church a few hundred years ago? You can't reform the Church which Our Lord founded.....you can only leave it.
36 2 Reply Share
Fisherman 19 hours ago
Joris Heise
Fisherman, you have a poor, poor sense of history. Not only did Constantine REALLY re-form the church (He started Christians persecuting one another for heresy, and, though a pagan himself, insisted on the Nicene Creed's creation, etc.). Pachomius & Benedict started monasticism, and, having asked Francis of Assisi explicit to "rebuild My Church," the Lord definitely instituted, through Francis, significant re-forms, including the efforts to eliminate simony and other financial sins.
4 9 Reply Share
dplunkt
Joris Heise 18 hours ago
Hello Mr. Heise, reforming in an effort to rid the Church of "sin" should and is an ongoing reform project. However, I think Fisherman;s fear is that "reform" will be a cover term for introducing sin into the Church, same sex marriage for example.
13 1 Reply Share
Hegesippus
Irenaeus wrote 'Against Heresies' over a century before Constantine's conversion. And Hegesippus was identifying was identifying their creep into the churches before that. Eusebius is a good place to start for historical accuracy.
Fisherman 19 hours ago
Ironic, isn't it, that the Church has changed sufficiently -- without reforming, which is your thesis -- that many of the criticisms leveled by Luther are
30/04/13 08:00
no longer applicable. And you might also be interested to know that Pope Benedict himself, in one of his final addresses, pointed out the need for the Church to continually develop. You seem to be describing a type of fundamentalism, which Catholic theology rejects out of hand...as well as the pastoral idea of "love it or leave it." Can you steer me towards the materials that form your thinking on these matters? I have not encountered them in Catholicism. Except in blog comments, I should say.
3 Reply Share
AuthenticBioethics
Not all reforms or developments are good and many in fact would cause the Church to abandon the Faith. The putative reforms called for by this German conference cannot achieved if the Church is to remain Catholic. This article, and the words attributed to that archbishop, are full of factual errors.
AuthenticBioethics 19 hours ago
Can you point out some of the errors in the article so that we can discuss them?
2 Reply Share
John Rayner
The Deaconate is part of Priesthood. The Church has already declared that it is not able to ordain women to the priesthood. This is an infallible, binding, declaration. For just that reason it cannot ordain women as Deacons ever. We already have women in the Church who attend to the poor, the sick and the displaced, These women are called "nuns". Perhaps Germany is lacking in nuns!
9 Reply Share
Gary Simmons
Bingo, John. The clergy, including the Deaconate, is part of what is handed down by Jesus. Nobody may amend its form but Jesus. Now, the Cardinalate or the religious, that's a different matter. Women are quite capable of being religious and thus serving the Church. To say that deacon requirements can be changed based on a democratic vote or a bishop's fiat is ridiculous.
4 Reply Share
Pgina 8 de 22
Rudy Auerbach
Infallibility is the result of Vatican I - one of the biggest
30/04/13 08:00
Infallibility is the result of Vatican I - one of the biggest mistakes the Church ever made and needing to be completely abandoned.
1 dplunkt Reply Share
hello greg, many of the criticized things introduced by Luther are still applicable today, "Bible alone" is one example. Having said that I think the Church does develop but is dosen't "Change". What I mean is that what was "sin" in the first century is still "sin" today. That act on homosexual intercourse is and will always be considered disordered for example. But...how we treat the sinner can develop (e.g. we don't kill folks for heresy anymore). With regard to how divorced and remarried couples are dealt with is an opportunity for the Church I think.
3 Reply Share
dplunkt 8 hours ago
Rudy Auerbach
Nonsense. Eating meat on Friday used to be mortal sin and - poof - it's gone! Limbo - poof - gone, too! We apologize to Galileo because he was right about the solar system and the Bible and the Church were wrong. It changes, and it needs to change more - or as Obama and Darwin would say, "evolve."
1 JoFro Reply Share
Rudy Auerbach 4 hours ago
Oh please! Eating meat on Fridays was never dogma! It was a discipline. Limbo was never ever dogma! It was discussed for centuries but the Church never made an official statement until recently. And no, the Church apologised for the way it handled the Galileo affair, it didn't apologise for condemning Galileo because Galileo was incorrect! Please read up on actual history rather than reading liberal screeds on the Catholic Church
Reply salvemaria
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21 hours ago
"Zollitsch said the Catholic Church could only regain credibility and strength by committing to reform." No, it would only make it more worldly, or specifically, egalitarian. In other words, more Marxist. The only inevitability about all this is that despite the 'errors of Russia' spreading throughout the world, The Immaculate Heart of Mary will triumph. Salve Maria!
30/04/13 08:00
Salve Maria!
16 Reply Share
salvemaria 19 hours ago
AuthenticBioethics
Right. And the other thing is: Credibility and strength in whose estimation? Do we really need to be credible in the eyes of the people who want this sort of change? Or credible in the eyes of Him Who established the Church and the priesthood in the way He did?
Recognizing the ministry of women in a formal way -- as the Church has done in its past -- is hardly egalitarianism, never mind Marxism. As we discuss the how best to facilitate the Church's pastoral mission (to which men are NOT flocking), I hope we can get beyond this type of dialogue. I would also point out that the first "Christian" ministry was a woman's: Mary accepting the ministry of theotokos.
2 3 Reply Share
Joris Heise
Marxist? Marxist? You have no idea what Marxism is, and you could be as easily accusing it of becoming more Zoroastrian!
2 3 Reply Share
AuthenticBioethics
Actually, it's pretty Marxist, at least with respect to the Communist Manifesto. Marx approved of all manner of upheaval and had a world view of Oppressors vs Oppressed, and the role of women in society and the destruction of gender stereotypes and the traditional family are all part of it.
AuthenticBioethics 18 hours ago
Jesus approved of all manner of upheaval and had a world view of Oppressors vs Oppressed (See Walter Wink, "Jesus and Non-Violence). So are you trying to assert that Jesus was a Marxist? How about Gustavo Gutierrez -- same question. And so that I am clear, can you help me understand how ordaining women as deacons causes destruction to gender stereotypes and the traditional family?
1 3 Reply Share
Gary Simmons
Wink, God rest his soul, is a rather biased source on the matter. And he had serious problems interacting with any opposing views. His rather vicious and childish review of Robert Gagnon's
30/04/13 08:00
views. His rather vicious and childish review of Robert Gagnon's "The Bible and Homosexual Practice" is evidence enough of that. Oppressors vs Oppressed was not a primary metanarrative in Jesus texts. Rather, it was Jesus vs. the Jewish establishment which had perverted the law. Note how Jesus spoke well of the centurion in Matthew 8, despite the fact that the Centurion is part of the Roman army that subjugated and occupied God's promised land of Palestine. He is an oppressor par excellence, but a good guy on the wrong side. However, his faith proved a foil for the faithlessness of ALL Israel. THAT is the central theme is rather Jesus vs. establishment Judaism.
Reply Reg Platt
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a day ago
Yes, of course. Transparency is the way to go in managing progressive change in the Church. Female Holy Orders and an acceptance of alternate lifestyles are inevitable, since our society has already evolved in its understanding of how the antiquated notions of 'sin' and 'gender roles,' or of 'good' and 'bad,' or 'true' and 'false' have held back the Church from the popularity it could obtain. After all, destroying an eternal and unchanging Church to save it as if it were a popular nightclub on the skids makes sense, and when the progressives present the next change to what they're currently proposing (because after all, it's only true for now), the pieces of the reconstituted Church can be swept together into yet another new configuration that will no doubt delight Jesus when He returns to judge the living and the dead and cast all those who have chosen love of themselves over Him into eternal fire (although He won't because that would be "judgmental.") I suppose that you guys could just get out of the unchanging and eternal Church and become Protestants, or is dragging the rest of us to Hell with you just too saucy an idea to pass up?
24 1 Reply Share
Reg Platt 17 hours ago
wissahickon
Exactly, Reg. Why is it more important for them to stink up our spiritual home than to enjoy the warm welcome that like-minded sects would offer?
2 David 13 Brad 12

1
a day ago
Reply
Share
He's nuts....legit nuts...

Reply
21 hours ago
Share
Not going to happen.

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Pgina 11 de 22
30/04/13 08:00
DeaconJohnMBresnahan
20 hours ago
First--there were no women ordained in the first group ordained with St. Stephen just as there were no women chosen by Christ to be among his priests, the apostles. Second, since deacons are considered under Holy Orders, it is clear that if deaconesses are ordained, the Catholic Church will begin to crumble and disintegrate as have so many mainstream Protestant churches like the Episcopalians. People don't trust a religion that becomes a lapdog for the secular world.
10 Reply Joris Heise Share
DeaconJohnMBresnahan 19 hours ago
it is clear that if deaconesses are ordained, the Catholic Church will begin to crumble and disintegrate as have so many mainstream Protestant churches like the Episcopalians. gratis asseritur, gratis negatur. It is NOT clear. If it is God's will--not to become a "lapdog for the secular world--if it IS God's will, then we will have not only women deacons, but women priests. Why do critics so often cede to human motives in addressing changes in the Church. The Seven Sacraments are wonderful signs of grace, but, as Blessed Cardinal Newman pointed out, they evolved and grew out of seeds in the early church--not to cater to secular needs, but to grow the Will of God in response to the living Body of Christ. Look at the evolution of the Sacrament of Confession. It wasn't to a priest at all back then--some 1600 years ago. It changed over the centuries. why cannot "ordinations" be of the same seed-like development--if it is of God. If apriori, you say it is not of God--then you are Adam and Eve deciding good and evil for yourself, and breaking the First Commandment. If it is of God, it will happen because He wants it...not because it is Marxist, secular, or criminally insane.
1 4 Reply Share
AuthenticBioethics
Your analogy to Confession is not good. Confession itself has always had the same matter and form, the same minister and recipient the manner of its implementation has developed, but not the Sacrament itself. As far as I can tell from the pertinent magisterial documents, the Sacrament of Holy Orders simply does not work (given the right form and minister) on a woman, the way the Sacrament of Confirmation, though all other things being right, does not work on the unbaptized. The Church has not been given by God the power to ordain women to the priesthood, of which the diaconate is a part.
6 Reg Platt Reply Share
God has made his will known, through the actions of the Church, protected from teaching error by the Holy Spirit. If the Church (or anyone with even a small understanding of how this all works) rejects female
30/04/13 08:00
ordinations a priori (as you say, only without the space) because it is not God's will, it is not her being "Adam and Eve deciding good and evil for [her]self,' but rather her performing her duty to protect the Deposit of Faith, and it would be you breaking the First Commandment by putting your judgment ahead of hers, and therefor ahead of God's. This, of course, must not be what you meant, because you love and respect the Bride of Christ and would not want to be caught at Judgment in opposition to her, right? Because I sure wouldn't want that for you, either. It is Christ's promise of protection against the gates of hell and the duty inherent in the Sacred Keys that will prevent the Church from crumbling and disintegrating. And that is why there will never be female deacons or priests.
5 Marcy Castro 9
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20 hours ago
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Another heretic.
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Magdalene Prodigal
19 hours ago
How well is all that working in the Lutheran and Episcopal communities? Are they bursting at the seams? The bishop does not seem to know or understand the theology of Holy Orders.
10 1
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Patty Rains
19 hours ago
This guy must'v wanted to be POPE...and wasn't..so he's trying to confirm insurrection within the Church...pushing the situation even more. Our church has been in great chaos. This guy doesn't alleviate the sickness that's already permeating Her. How dare he pummel Her even more. Praying for sinners is one thing but inviting them to instigate and be part of breaking Her down is totally from Hell. This 'arch' should be defrocked. Pope Francis I, hopefully will deal with this man very soon.
5 Reply Share
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