Gun talk: General: Rental Agreements

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damien
Posted Sep 19, 2006 @ 2:23 pm
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Send mail: Gun Clauses in Rental Agreements
- packingEmail Let me say I was a good boy and searched first on this and there is no
threads except one about public housing.

In a different thread, BigDaddy5 wrote something that got my interest:

"I've been carrying in Seattle for several months. The only problem I had
was when I interacted with my landlord, who tried to have me evicted
because of it. But since her parenting company not only permits it, but
includes regulations for firearms in their lease agreement, she couldn't do
it. "

(good thing she is getting parenting, she should get some analysis also for
her hoplophobia.)

This is interesting because I read my lease agreements (both of them) and

I haven't had one talking about firearms at all. How often do rental
agreements make some sort of regulation on the ownership of firearms by
the renter?
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FLEMTP
Posted Sep 19, 2006 @ 2:36 pm
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Send mail: mine says something in it.
- packingEmail Its been a while since ive read mine over, but it says something to the
effect of pretty much " no guns allowed". I still carry and keep my guns
here. what they dont know wont hurt them, and if they want to try and
evict me for it, fine, i'll spend my rent money with a gun friendly
management company. :-)
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herbstnebel2ss
Posted Sep 19, 2006 @ 3:00 pm
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Send mail: Rental agreements.....................
- internet I think you brought up a good point. What it should come down to is,
- packingEmail what does your state constitution say? If it guarantees your right to keep
and bear arms this would probably put your landlord behind the 8 ball.
You could probably even take legal action against them. Since there's
nothing in the agreement you are no doubt on firm ground.
Granted rentals are private property, but they sure couldn't specify what
you can say or what church you go to. Also as a tenant you have specific
rights.

If it weren't for guns, we'd be British......

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benminer
Posted Sep 19, 2006 @ 3:14 pm
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Send mail: Virginia
- internet VA specifically forbids this
- packingEmail
http://leg1.state.va.us/cgi-bin/legp504.exe?000+cod+55-248.9
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1swellguy
Posted Sep 19, 2006 @ 3:15 pm
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Send mail: never seen such a clause
- packingEmail I've rented many times over the years and never have I seen such a clause.
If I had seen one, I would demand that it be removed. If they refused, I'd
go elsewhere. Even if I didn't carry or own firearms, I'd object to stealth
attempts like this at infringing upon a citizen's right to self defense. I have
no desire to put my money into the pockets of an anti-gunner landlord.
Let him starve before he gets my hard-earned cash.

Having such a clause also makes it more probable that your premises will
be attacked. You are less safe than in another location. It doesn't take the
bad guys long to figure out where they can be safer as they commit their
crimes. This is exactly why no school should ban firearms. Once you do,
that's exactly where the killers show up.

And you'll be the one getting sued by your landlord if you ever have to
defend your life. And the courts will probably be on his side because of
that clause.

http://www.cafepress.com/1swellguy
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damien
Posted Sep 19, 2006 @ 3:16 pm
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Send mail: Thanks
- packingEmail I'm more interested if anyone has a restrictive clause in their rental
agreements. Figuring out if it is enforcable is more than I am willing to
think about.

I am surprised that the first response says that guns are not allowed in the
poster's agreement. I wonder how common this is. This is the USA after
all, and I would think that it would not be very common at all. How many
others have a similar restriction?
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BigDaddy5
Posted Sep 20, 2006 @ 2:13 am
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- packingEmail .
Heh, I saw this thread, and thought I'd chime in my experience in a little
more detail...
So, my former landlord's company required all residents to register their
weapons with the front desk. I, being a responsible gun owner, was
pleased that I had at least landed a company wasn't anti-gun in the heart
of Seattle.

So I took my proof of purchase, my CHL (just incase), my weapon's

storage case (because the agreement stipulated I may have to show that, if
asked) and the 92FS, and I went up to the front office.

I went in there with the agreement subsection memorized, and asked

about it. The look on her face was classic. She fumbled around her words
for a while, and said she'd have to look it up. I directed her to the section
she needed, and she went to read it. She came back and asked for
everything, still fairly uneasy.

Keep in mind, she's a German national, so I don't completely fault her, as

a handgun there is very rare.

Well, she asked for the proof of ownership, so I gave her the receipt.
Then she asked for my "gun license." I explained to her multiple times
that owning a firearm doesn't require a license in the United States. After
trying calmly to explain, I produced my CHL. She photocopied
everything, then examined my weapon's case.

I thought everything was over after that.

Weeks later, my roommate (pdo member mhawk) was hired as a

maintenance worker, and began to talk to his supervisor. Turns out,
immediatly afterwards, my landlord tried to ask the police for advice on
how to evict me. Apparently the police told her they can't do anything,
since I did everything in accordance to the lease agreement. She then ran
a background check on me, which obviously turned up clean. Current
rumors from the office have said that she has been pushing for the
management company to completely ban firearms in the apartment
complex.

mhawk grabbed a lot of the paperwork out of my file for me, after he told
me what he saw. I didn't want to leave there with my CHL and seriel #'s
on file.

I have to say, after this experience, I think I'm just gonna keep my mouth
shut about this. I'm now moving to Eastern Washington, so a little less
gunaphobic, but even still, you never know.

Honestly, one of the only reasons I registered my handgun with them was
 because one of the roommates I was living with was a total douchebag,
and would have ratted me out if he knew I had a weapon that was
unregistered with them. Turns out, he never knew I had one, even after I
open carried in a military issue holster, and a kydex paddle holster, in
front of him. Oh, well, hindsight...
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jaeroo
Posted Sep 20, 2006 @ 3:41 am
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Send mail: Never
- packingEmail I never ever saw any clause about firearms ownership in all my years of
renting an apartment. All they did was check my background, especially
my criminal record and my current occupation
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Gray Fox
Posted Sep 20, 2006 @ 5:36 am
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Send mail: Landlord issues
- internet One of my friends is facing living in a "gun free" rental house that's in the
- packingEmail lease agreement. Of course, I find out about this a WEEK before they
were going to move in, and they've already signed the lease agreement for
6 months. Ugh. I was mad as hell. Of course they are on their last ropes
and they had this hail mary house come across with this as the ONLY
problem, so they don't view it as a problem. Grrr.

Washington unfortunately affords no protection in this regard, unlike

Virginia and Minnesota and a few other states. I urged them to move out
at the end of the 6 month term. Needless to say, I will be avoiding the
landlord and reporting them as an "anti-gun landlord" to some lists that I
know of.
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The_Eggman
Posted Sep 20, 2006 @ 10:03 am
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Send mail: 'Gun Free'
- packingEmail Any place that puts a clause such as that in a lease should be REQUIRED
BY LAW to have a big, "This is a Gun Free Residence" (iow a big 'Please
Come Rob, Rape and Kill Us') sign at all entrances.

The Eggman, DmAt,MSI, MPC

GSSF, VSSA, NRA, USCCA, VCDL, AFIO
(eieio)
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VegasTech702
Posted Sep 20, 2006 @ 11:43 am
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Send mail: My central Las Vegas apt
- packingEmail When I was looking for a new apartment here in central las vegas, I
carried my 92FS openly on my hip in a holster. I had a lot of cash and
wasn't going to not carry because someone might get offended. So
anyways, I signed my lease while carrying.

Months later, I was getting my mail, when one of the security guards
approached me. He wasn't really rude about anything, but told me that I
would need to get a written statement from the property manager
allowing my carrying. I told him that, I would talk to her about it but not
expect me to stop carrying if she didn't give consent. The manager pretty
much said her position will not allow her to sign such a document for
liability reasons, but as long as I didn't cause trouble, what she didn't
know wouldn't hurt her.

The next week I spoke with the supervisor of the security group and he,
already knowing me, had absolutely no problems with my carrying. He
more or less believes that I might come in handy if there is ever a shoot
out involving them and I am armed to offer assistance.
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230rn
Posted Sep 24, 2006 @ 11:01 am
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Send mail:
- packingEmail Colorado --Denver area
Well, darn it, now I had to go and get my glasses to check out my own
lease.

I've only got a spotty re-re-re-copied version of it right now, but it looks
like I'm OK. There's a clause in it about observing all local PD, Fire, and
Municipal laws, either now in effect or enacted in future, and there's the
usual "nuisance clause," but nothing explicitly related to firearms. I
reckon if I fired a thirty--ought-six out my front door, I'd be in trouble.

It does talk about storing inflammables and the like, but I'm not sure what
that means --everybody's got charcoal starter and propane tanks, with no
reaction from the managers. It talks about not driving nails into the wall,
but the manager has all kinds of stuff hung from his wall --presumably
they're magnetically suspended to avoid nails.

This is a standard lease form, available from most office supply stores,
but I decline to mention the company which printed them or the form
number.

The upshot, I guess, is if you legally own firearms, any "anti-" clauses are
there more for moral suasion than anything else, and just provides an
avenue for eviction if necessary. That's the "flavor" of the rest of the
boiler-plate restrictions.

I'm pretty circumspect about toting firearms anyhow, and only one trusted
person in the whole complex knows I have some. I even stick my long
arms in a curtain rod box to transport them out to the car, and I usually do
this in the dead of the night before I go to the range.

I got only one comment about how heavy my range bag looked (a big
leather traveling bag with five boxes of assorted ammo, plus guns) once
when I slung it over my shoulder and ventured out to my car.

I just told them it was full of some books I was giving to the library.
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