THE FUNDAMENTAL DIFFERENCE BETWEEN VEDA AND TANTRA

It is not enough to say that the ideological difference between Veda and
Tantra is wide; rather one should say that it is very wide. Tantra is a
practical and natural process and is thus easily practised and followed by
the members of society. People easily accept it as their own.

There is a shloka in the Vedas that begins, Uttis't'hata ja'grata pra'pya

bara'nnibodhata -- that is, "Arise, awake. Seek a competent teacher and
start moving along the path of spirituality." This is similar to the spirit
of Tantra. But the Veda further says,

Ks'urasya dha'ra' nishita' duratyaya'.

Durgam' pathastat kavayo vadanti.

That is, "The path is as sharp as a razor's edge, so move along it

carefully."

Here Tantra begins to differ from Veda. The process of Tantra progressively
develops the qualities latent in human beings and at the same time
eliminates the defects. In Tantra, therefore, there is no question of the
path being as sharp as a razor's edge. Because of this spirit, a
practitioner of Tantra becomes elevated and attains mastery over a hostile
environment. Tantra does not accept the teachings of the Vedas that human
beings should move internally, and carefully avoid any association with
their environment. Rather, Tantra suggests that spiritual aspirants should
rid their minds of fear from the very beginning. The Vedas maintain,
however, that fear will be automatically removed from the mind some day in
the process of sa'dhana'; but who knows when that auspicious moment will
come? It is not desirable to wait indefinitely for that. Moreover, while
moving in this way, something unexpected might happen which might be
detrimental to individual and collective growth.

So Tantra advises, "Jump into your environment without the least hesitation.
Don't be afraid. Fear will leave you step by step. Tomorrow you will not be
as fearful as you are today, the day after you will be even less fearful,
and ten days from now you'll notice that you are completely fearless." The
process of Tantra sa'dhana' is formulated along these lines. The very first
night that a Tantric goes to the burial ground he is stricken with fear;
there is horripilation all over the body. But when he returns home after
finishing sa'dhana', the mind is much lighter than before. When he goes out
for sa'dhana' the next night, he is much less fearful. And thus the Tantric
steadily and slowly overcomes fear. This is the applied process of Tantra
which will help the practitioner overcome all mental propensities. In
Tantra, there is a nice blending between the internal sa'dhana', an ongoing
psychic process, and physico-psychic sa'dhana'. In the Vedas, however,
physico-psychic sa'dhana' is totally absent -- only psychic sa'dhana' is
practised, which may lead to trouble.

Tantra is of the opinion that the Vedas cannot fulfil the hopes of beginners
on the spiritual path -- the hopes of making some discernible spiritual
progress at the outset. In fact there is often retardation. That is why the
Vedic system of sa'dhana' has been almost totally rejected by society. Even
in the past it was not widely popular, and today it is practised by only a
few people. And the little Vedic sa'dhana' which is practised today is
merely a few prayers to Parama Purus'a. For example, they pray, "O Lord,
show me the way. Please help me get Tantric initiation."

So Vedic initiation today is just the first step towards Tantric initiation.
The sa'dhaka says, "O Lord, I want to follow the path of spirituality and
wish to practise the Tantric process of sa'dhana'. Please give me the
opportunity to learn it."

Sarve ca pashavah santi talavad bhu'tale nara'h:

Tes'a'm' jina'napraka'sha'ya viirabha'vah praka'shitah;
Viirabha'vam' sada' pra'pya kramena devata' bhavet.
--Rudraya'mala Tantra

"At the first stage all human beings are as good as animals." Unable to find
the light of knowledge, they fail to understand what is to be done and what
is not to be done. When one is unaware of the dos and don'ts of life, one is
no better than an animal. One will have to rise higher step by step.

"When one masters the first stage of Tantra sa'dhana', and acquires some
knowledge and intellect and learns about the dos and don'ts of life, one is
no longer like an animal but is a veritable hero." In Tantra that system of
sa'dhana' is called viira'ca'ra. Viirabha'vam' sada' pra'pya kramena devata'
bha'vet -- "while doing sa'dhana' in viirabha'va [the ideation of
viira'ca'ra], the sa'dhaka merges in that viirabha'va."

And just as one who fights against the fear instinct is called a
viira'ca'rii, one who has overcome fear, who has gone beyond fear, is called
a divya'ca'rii. And the divya'ca'rii who successfully defeats the ripus and
the pa'shas* and, rising above petty selfishness, identifies himself or
herself with the collective interest, becomes one with Parama Purus'a. This
gradual movement towards the supreme goal is the path of Tantra. It is a
safe path where there is no scope for fear. And the naturalness of human
life is not impaired under any circumstances.

The Tantric sa'dhana' introduced by Sada'shiva was the first sa'dhana' to be

given in this world. Tantra sa'dhana' is the only sa'dhana'. Without
sa'dhana' there is no Tantra and without Tantra there is no sa'dhana'.

Tantra has yet another speciality. According to the Vedas, practical life is
guided by theory. But the efficacy of a theory should first be tested in the
practical sphere. Movement on the basis of an untested theory may or may not

be fruitful. The theory of Tantra has been evolved on the basis of practical
experience on the path. And as the theory is formulated on the basis of
efficacy in the field of application, it always leads to success. It is
infallible in applied life.

Shrii Shrii Anandamurti

13 November 1978 morning, Calcutta

A'nanda Vacana'mrtam Part 5

* The s'ad'ripu, or six enemies, of the mind are ka'ma [longing for physical
pleasure], krodha [anger], lobha [avarice], mada [vanity], moha [blind
attachment], and ma'tsarya [envy]. The as't'apa'sha, or eight fetters, are
ghrn'a' [hatred, revulsion], shaunka [doubt], bhaya [fear], lajja'
[shyness], jugupsa' [dissemblance], kula [vanity of lineage], shiila
[cultural superiority complex], and ma'na [egotism]. --Eds.

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From: Virendra Verma - view profile

Date: Thurs, Apr 25 2002 8:06 pm
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"Dharmadeva" <u961...@student.canberra.edu.au> wrote in message <news:Wzwx8.44390$o66.137961@news-
server.bigpond.net.au>...
> THE FUNDAMENTAL DIFFERENCE BETWEEN VEDA AND TANTRA

> That is, "The path is as sharp as a razor's edge, so move along it
> carefully."

> Here Tantra begins to differ from Veda.

That's your interpretation. I didn't read into the verse Tantra

criticising Vedas or vice versa. Could it be that both are right as
Gita says. All paths lead to the same Truth. The difference lies only
in the nature of the seeker and the level of burning desire (i.e.,
level of impatience which translates into how quick one wants to get
there). This leads to three ways - Gyana, Karma and Bhakti yoga.
Tantra falls roughly into the last two. When Vedas refer path sharp as
razor, it is in the next of Gyana Yoga which require that the mind
must be as sharp as razor to follow the path of Gyana Yoga. Gyana Yoga
leads to quicker results than other two Yogas. I don't see any
inconsistency.

I wonder why people look at Hinduism from a negative angle? Vedas and
scriptures cannot be read and interpreted from simplistic and isolated
view such as the above. One has to look at each scriptures as a
solidifying and complementary component rather than as a tool to fight
one over the other.

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From: Ramakrishna Rao - view profile

Date: Thurs, Apr 25 2002 10:08 pm

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In article <30ee7e04.0204250636.6511d...@posting.google.com>,
virenbe...@hotmail.com (Virendra Verma) wrote:

- Show quoted text -

Greetings, Virendra Verma

Nobody here pays any attention to Dogma Dave the Sprout Boy. He has
absoutely no idea what he's talking about. His absurd posts have
single-handedly ruined the AMT NG.

Of course, you are correct about Tantra. The traditions of Tantra, as

with the traditions of the Vedas, are two separate albeit sometimes
parallel paths to truth.

IMO, having multiple paths is wonderful because every person is an

individual. What works for one person may not work for another.

The problem becomes when you have people like Dogma Dave who want you to
only believe their way. That leads to Inquisitions, Crusades, Pogroms,
Witch Burnings, Concentration Camps, etc.

RR

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From: Dharmadeva - view profile

Date: Sat, Apr 27 2002 6:46 am

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"Virendra Verma" <virenbe...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> > THE FUNDAMENTAL DIFFERENCE BETWEEN VEDA AND TANTRA

Could it be that both are right as

> Gita says. All paths lead to the same Truth.

There is only one path and that is of psycho-spiritual channelisation

towards the Supreme (God). The only question after that is one of
effectiveness.

The difference lies only

> in the nature of the seeker and the level of burning desire (i.e.,
> level of impatience which translates into how quick one wants to get
> there).

Burning samskara (reactions to past actions) is the what really happens.

There should only be one desire and that is for the Supreme.

This leads to three ways - Gyana, Karma and Bhakti yoga.

Gyana Yoga

> leads to quicker results than other two Yogas. I don't see any
> inconsistency.

Jinana is intellectual, but bhakti is devotional - the surest way.

Intellectualism is a limted aspect of mind, but like karma (action) it is
also useful