In a fast-moving episode, designers Andy Budd and Jeffrey Zeldman discuss why clients spend more on toilet cleaning than design, honest pitching, the ins and outs of agile pricing, modular code libraries, selling web services instead of deliverables, the maturation of our industry since the mid-1990s, the value of reputation, design as a collaborative process, how and why agencies get invited to pitch, passion as studio marketing, our field's evolution from layout-making to strategic design thinking, and much more.